How do you understand growled/screamed vocals?

[WeaponFire]

I just want to lol at that entire post.

Regardless of whatever you find funny about my post I honestly believe black metal is the absolute worst genre of heavy metal. Doom I moderately like, and death metal at the very least has an experimental side, but black metal is ****.
Pantera, Metallica, Slayer......take your pick, they've all made better music than anything I've heard come from black metal.

 

[LoxxO)))]

I said all of it.

 

[X-pert74]

I honestly believe black metal music is vastly superior to Pantera, Metallica, and Slayer.

What do you have to say about that?

 

[Windhelm]

I don't need to know what they're singing about, it's more about feeling the passion in the delivery. Narrative and storytelling is secondary. I love Sepultura.

 

[ThePainkiller]

I don't pay attention to vocals most of the time. It's just another instrument as far as I'm concerned. Lyrical content is overrated anyway.

 

[LoxxO)))]

I don't pay attention to vocals most of the time. It's just another instrument as far as I'm concerned. Lyrical content is overrated anyway.

100% correct. Yes, sir. Yes.

 

[DRExLOC]

I honestly believe black metal music is vastly superior to Metallica, and Slayer.

What do you have to say about that?

I'd say that you're very wrong.

I honestly believe that the first four Metallica albums, and the first five Slayer albums are vastly superior to most black metal.

I can without a doubt say that Show No Mercy, Hell Awaits, Reign in Blood, Ride the Lightning and Kill Em All completely shit on any and every black metal album to have ever come out.

 

[LoxxO)))]

Nah, brah. i'd take Burzum's Filosefem and Belus. And Wolves in the Throne Room's Two Hunters, Malevolent Grain, and Celestial Lineage over most thrash albums. Including those you mentioned. NOT TO MENTION Weakling's Dead As Dreams. Which I will hipstertafically refer to as the best black metal album ever.

 

[DRExLOC]

This is a vicious circle that just wont end, lol. ... well, not really vicious but yawhatever.

The albums i listed are only from the bands that you guys mentioned, because there are pleeeeenty of other albums i could have included, from a shitload of other bands.

My favorite black metal albums would probably have to be The Somberlain, Paracletus, Under the Sign of the Black Mark, A Blaze in the Northern Sky, Under a Funeral Moon, Filosofem, De Mysteriis , Blood in Our Wells and of course In The Sign of Evil(call it whatever you guys want, it is without a doubt one of the first black metal albums)

I also really enjoy Inquisition, Satyricon, old Gorgoroth, Enslaved, and a few albums from Immortal.

I'd still take Rust in Peace and Killing is My Business over everything i mentioned there ... my two favorite thrash metal albums.

I still love you guys though.

 

[X-pert74]

I like thrash metal slightly more than black metal... but not those bands you're listing I do think most of Slayer's '80s material is great, and Metallica's Kill 'Em All is one of my absolute favorite albums ever, but overall there are other thrash metal bands I prefer listening to, like Possessed, Celtic Frost, Destruction, Venom, and Protected Illusion.

 

[LoxxO)))]

Bro... Blaze, Funeral Moon, and De Mysteriis some of the best EVER.

Yeah... I'm just not a fan of thrash though.... That's not to say I don't love early Metallica and Slayer, though. I do. I just like black metal more. YOU KNOW THAT, BRAH.

 

[DRExLOC]

lol i know, im just stirring the pot a little ... its been pretty dead here last few months.

You guys should check out Denouncement Pyre if you dont mind a little bit of death metal thrown in.

Also, I had to edit Sodom's In The Sign of Evil in there.

 

[LoxxO)))]

I think I'd prefer death/thrash over thrash or death, honestly. Both are pretty boring genres to me right now, but the mix could so something for me. I'll check them out.

 

[DRExLOC]

I like thrash metal slightly more than black metal... but not those bands you're listing I do think most of Slayer's '80s material is great, and Metallica's Kill 'Em All is one of my absolute favorite albums ever, but overall there are other thrash metal bands I prefer listening to, like Possessed, Celtic Frost, Destruction, Venom, and Protected Illusion.

Well, the only true thrash band you listed there is Destruction. I haven't heard of Protected Illusion, so i cant really comment on them. But yea same here, i enjoy both but thrash metal is my favorite music so we obviously know which way i'm leaning. For me it would go Thrash > Death > "Heavy Metal"(Sabbath, Rainbow, Deep Purple etc) > Black Metal > the rest.

 

[DRExLOC]

I think I'd prefer death/thrash over thrash or death, honestly. Both are pretty boring genres to me right now, but the mix could so something for me. I'll check them out.

They're black/death. I dont want to call it blackened death metal because its more BM than DM.

I can bust out a huge fucking list of death/thrash and blackened thrash bands, but ill try to keep this short. For good blackened thrash start off with Destroyer 666 and Salvation Like Destruction from Assaulter. For good death/thrash your best bet would be stuff from early death metal pioneers like Malleus Maleficarum from Pestilence and Piece of Time from Atheist. Supernatural Addiction from Deceased and the first two from Protector are also pretty bad ass albums.

edit: Also, you HHHHAAAVVVE to check out Vektor if you haven't already ... i promise, you wont regret it.

 

[X-pert74]

I think I'd prefer death/thrash over thrash or death, honestly. Both are pretty boring genres to me right now, but the mix could so something for me. I'll check them out.

You should definitely look more into death/thrash; it's an awesome mix

I like thrash metal slightly more than black metal... but not those bands you're listing I do think most of Slayer's '80s material is great, and Metallica's Kill 'Em All is one of my absolute favorite albums ever, but overall there are other thrash metal bands I prefer listening to, like Possessed, Celtic Frost, Destruction, Venom, and Protected Illusion.

Well, the only true thrash band you listed there is Destruction. I haven't heard of Protected Illusion, so i cant really comment on them. But yea same here, i enjoy both but thrash metal is my favorite music so we obviously know which way i'm leaning. For me it would go Thrash > Death > "Heavy Metal"(Sabbath, Rainbow, Deep Purple etc) > Black Metal > the rest.

Celtic Frost's music encompasses a lot of genres, true. I would consider Morbid Tales and To Mega Therion to be primarily thrash metal albums though. And Possessed and Venom are mostly thrash metal; some people consider Seven Churches a death metal album, and I used to as well, but I'd even consider that a thrash metal album today. As for Venom, their first album is kind of mostly raw as hell, unpolished heavy metal with a punkish attitude, but starting around Black Metal, I'd say their music became primarily thrash metal. They do kind of drift a lot between thrash metal and heavy metal though, and also groove metal on some of their newer material.

Protected Illusion is a super cool band


I guess some might consider them death/thrash, which they kind of are, but I think they lean a little more toward thrash metal rather than death metal.


Also Loxxorz, I too highly recommend Pestilence's Malleus Maleficarum. It's like Sepultura's Beneath The Remains, but one year earlier and much more intense and insane.

 

[DRExLOC]

It's quite different from Beneath the Remains ... which is pretty much straight just straight forward thrash metal. Only Sep albums that i would say fall under the death/thrash category would be their first and maaaayyyybeee Schizophrenia(which personally consider straight thrash). Some people have even thrown in black metal when describing Morbid Visions and Bestial Devastation. Those Sepultura albums all blow Malleus Maleficarum out of the water though.

Venom were one of the original speed metal bands, and were about as much of a thrash band as Motorhead ... they were both major influences on the sub-genre, but they did not play thrash metal. Like you said, they played heavy/speed metal with a bit of punk sprinkled on top, and they were one of the first ... they're basically the forefathers of speed metal. There are plenty of "thrash traits" missing from their music, the main one being the thrash riffs.

 

[X-pert74]

heh, well I don't consider "speed metal" to be a distinct enough sound worth differentiating from heavy or thrash metal I avoid using that term, period.

Beneath The Remains I think is at least as "death"-ish as Malleus Maleficarum... which I don't consider death/thrash, personally. Both of those albums I would just consider thrash metal; albeit really aggressive thrash metal with perhaps some light aesthetic qualities that might sound reminiscent of death metal. I haven't heard Schizophrenia, but I can definitely see someone calling Morbid Visions a proto-black metal album.

Haha, I can't remember the last time I had any sort of debate like this about metal subgenres.

 

[Blugeoner86]

lol i know, im just stirring the pot a little ... its been pretty dead here last few months.

Months? Try years!

 

[DRExLOC]

Absu is another great thrash/black band ... i remember getting into another sub-genre debate over that band yeaaaars ago.

 

[LoxxO)))]

I missed over some posts in this thread. I do like Vektor. I believe you and I have talked about them before. They're one of the few 'thrash' bands that I enjoy. They're damn good.

 

[wpnfire]

Since this thread has mellowed out a lot I guess I'll add that I've had a few startling revelations with black metal in the recent weeks, and while I'm still not a fan of 2nd wave 90s-and-beyond black metal for the most part (I also understand now that it's a incredibly varied genre, but the notable bands) I will say that I no longer agree with this statement.

the first four Metallica albums(especially the first three) shit on just about every black metal album in existence. They completely obliterate and destroy everything wolves in the throne room, burzum, and weakling have ever done. And even thought i'm a big fan of Darkthrone and Dissection, neither of those bands have four undisputed classics under their belts and their best albums still dont stack up to Metallicas best, so yeah. But hey, this is just my opinion.

Thrash Metal >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Black Metal

Bathory's first 5 albums are pretty hard to ignore and argue against the impact that they had-even by a die hard thrash metal fan like myself-even if Bathory was still a fledgling first-wave-black-metal band at the time.
While I guess you could ignore their self-titled debut as it is much more akin to thrash than just their next album, which (The Return of Darkness and Evil) was a huge game changer and a fucking masterpiece IMO. Also, Quorthon was a genius I think.

Also I'm not trying to be argumentative here, like feel free to disagree with me.

 

[DanielKnight1988]

A lot of people suggesting that they don't focus much on a song's lyrics...am I the only one who finds that a bit off? Words have a lot of power, we should probably be more intentional about what we put in (even if we don't quite understand it because it washes over us.)

Beyond that, my view has been summed up already pretty much. Worst case scenario you can always turn to the lyrics sheet. Personally I've found though, the longer I immerse myself in the style of music the better I become at discerning the lyrics. Either that or the diction of the vocalists I listen to is improving with age

 

[X-pert74]

A lot of people suggesting that they don't focus much on a song's lyrics...am I the only one who finds that a bit off? Words have a lot of power, we should probably be more intentional about what we put in (even if we don't quite understand it because it washes over us.)

Beyond that, my view has been summed up already pretty much. Worst case scenario you can always turn to the lyrics sheet. Personally I've found though, the longer I immerse myself in the style of music the better I become at discerning the lyrics. Either that or the diction of the vocalists I listen to is improving with age

It probably is a bit off, but I too don't generally care about lyrics in the music I listen to. Even less so when I can barely make them out in the first place

Since this thread has mellowed out a lot I guess I'll add that I've had a few startling revelations with black metal in the recent weeks, and while I'm still not a fan of 2nd wave 90s-and-beyond black metal for the most part (I also understand now that it's a incredibly varied genre, but the notable bands) I will say that I no longer agree with this statement.

the first four Metallica albums(especially the first three) shit on just about every black metal album in existence. They completely obliterate and destroy everything wolves in the throne room, burzum, and weakling have ever done. And even thought i'm a big fan of Darkthrone and Dissection, neither of those bands have four undisputed classics under their belts and their best albums still dont stack up to Metallicas best, so yeah. But hey, this is just my opinion.

Thrash Metal >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Black Metal

Bathory's first 5 albums are pretty hard to ignore and argue against the impact that they had-even by a die hard thrash metal fan like myself-even if Bathory was still a fledgling first-wave-black-metal band at the time.
While I guess you could ignore their self-titled debut as it is much more akin to thrash than just their next album, which (The Return of Darkness and Evil) was a huge game changer and a fucking masterpiece IMO. Also, Quorthon was a genius I think.

Also I'm not trying to be argumentative here, like feel free to disagree with me.

That's cool; people are free to prefer different things

 

[LoxxO)))]

Personally, I think most metal lyrics (or maybe lyrics in general) aren't that great. Yeah, you could give examples of good lyrics and so could I... but I'd say the majority of things written are poor quality so I don't care too much. Or I just don't care about the subject matter. I'm not about a band's purpose or their agenda, I just want some good music to listen to. For instance, the band Hell (the Salem one) is fantastic. The imagery is all based on Dante Alighieri's The Divine Comedy as well. I love that. Sadly, the lyrics don't relate to that but are mostly anti-religious from what I can make out/have read. I can feel that, but I don't care. It would be one of those rare instances where lyrics mattered to me, but since it doesn't... I'd rather focus on the amazing music that is presented.

 

[Blugeoner86]

If you're listening to metal and focusing on the lyrics you're doing it wrong.

 

[DRExLOC]

Since this thread has mellowed out a lot I guess I'll add that I've had a few startling revelations with black metal in the recent weeks, and while I'm still not a fan of 2nd wave 90s-and-beyond black metal for the most part (I also understand now that it's a incredibly varied genre, but the notable bands) I will say that I no longer agree with this statement.

the first four Metallica albums(especially the first three) shit on just about every black metal album in existence. They completely obliterate and destroy everything wolves in the throne room, burzum, and weakling have ever done. And even thought i'm a big fan of Darkthrone and Dissection, neither of those bands have four undisputed classics under their belts and their best albums still dont stack up to Metallicas best, so yeah. But hey, this is just my opinion.

Thrash Metal >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Black Metal

Bathory's first 5 albums are pretty hard to ignore and argue against the impact that they had-even by a die hard thrash metal fan like myself-even if Bathory was still a fledgling first-wave-black-metal band at the time.
While I guess you could ignore their self-titled debut as it is much more akin to thrash than just their next album, which (The Return of Darkness and Evil) was a huge game changer and a fucking masterpiece IMO. Also, Quorthon was a genius I think.

Also I'm not trying to be argumentative here, like feel free to disagree with me.

I'm a huuuge Bathory fan and without a doubt agree with you, even mentioned them earlier in this thread as one of my favorites. But yeah, the first three Metallica albums are better than everything Quorthon has done, by far. Same can be said for Megadeth, Slayer, Testament etc when compared to Bathory. Everything that we say about Bathory having an impact and being gamechangers can be said and multiplied by 10 if we're talking about any of those thrash bands i mentioned. And like i said, pound for pound i would not even compare their records, as i think it would end up embarrassingly bad for Bathory or any other bands that fall under the black metal umbrella to be compared to the masterpiece albums from those bands.

Oh and their second album didn't stray away from thrash as much as you think, you might wanna give it another spin. Under the Sign is where i can without a doubt say that they were a black metal band. But yeah, their first four albums(and sometimes even Hammerheart) are always in rotation for me, heh.

 

[XPrayerX]

I don't listen to music I can't understand..

I know people that do, and they all say the same thing ''It's another instrument''

Can't really get into that tho.

 

[T89faye]

I'm horrendously late in posting here, but for me bands like Slipknot are usually fairly easy to understand. Bands like MIW however.. Well I feel like if you really like the way they, or the lead singer's voice sounds then you'll put in the effort to learn/understand the lyrics. Most of the growls are just used for sound purposes imo.

 

[Elvenking1985]

Some people listen to metal and can understand what the vocalist is saying i on the other hand love metal all kinds of metal but i love it for the instrumental aspect of it. To hear the sound of a drum kit beaing beating to oblivion just set's right with me and most songs i can make out what they are saying and i listen to all sorta of metal so screams,growls,guttural it's all how you look into.

 

[bran1986]

Your ear will get accustomed to it and you will make out the words much easier the more you listen. Some growls it really doesn't matter and is just similar to another instrument.

 

[WorldDownfall]

Simple, I don't concentrate on the lyrics. For example, with Cannibal Corpse's Tomb of The Mutilated (and all forms of Extreme Metal) I listen to the beat and rhythm. Most of the time the vocals are either a gimmick or just for show.

 

[ItsFait]

It also depends on the harsh vocalist some are easier to understand then others.

 

[resinparrot]

Your ear will get accustomed to it and you will make out the words much easier the more you listen. Some growls it really doesn't matter and is just similar to another instrument.

Completely agree with you. You get accustomed to the sound and then understand the words better.