Convince me to buy this game.... please

[Kettellkorn]

So I really really want to buy GT6. I loved GT5 but there was several things I hated like the fact that there was so many useless things (carwash etc.), boring races after awhile, and no car damage. But I got over it and enjoyed the game as much as I could.
So after I heard that GT6 had no car damage I was sooo disappointed but it was whatever. Now with day one micro transactions??
I want this game but so far there is literally no reason for me to buy it. Please... Convince me!

 

[woody938]

The Moon Rover is the most fun you'll ever have at 27km/h, that has some awesome fun challenges... though I've only tried one so far...

For Goodwood Hill Climb challenges you get an invite from the owner of the course and it is a little challenging to reach the times but the License Tests are easy compared to previous GTs so you won't get stuck white-knuckled with them so badly. The career has a good flow now (for the first time) so you can go from one thing to the next and there's plenty of variety to choose from along the way.

Those useless things are pretty minor details at the moment, the only thing significantly disappointing me is I've only had 5 opponents in career mode so far, I've had 9 in Arcade mode so I hope the numbers increase as I go on. Just a warning there's lots and lots of tips pop-ups along the way though.

 

[Nas-Escobar]

So I really really want to buy GT6. I loved GT5 but there was several things I hated like the fact that there was so many useless things (carwash etc.), boring races after awhile, and no car damage. But I got over it and enjoyed the game as much as I could.
So after I heard that GT6 had no car damage I was sooo disappointed but it was whatever. Now with day one micro transactions??
I want this game but so far there is literally no reason for me to buy it. Please... Convince me!

How to convince you when I'm trying to convince myself?

I'm going to buy my copy today. I agree it's a bummer no car damage. But it's not the end of the world. All I want is improved / more intelligent A.I., good competition and I'm hoping for a much improved online. But again back to car damage, if this was in the game especially for online play, it would force people to drive properly / professionally and not always be bumping into you unpurposely

 

[Ghost_16]

It bothers you that they have a car wash in the game...really? It's such a tiny thing, who cares.

 

[Kettellkorn]

So I really really want to buy GT6. I loved GT5 but there was several things I hated like the fact that there was so many useless things (carwash etc.), boring races after awhile, and no car damage. But I got over it and enjoyed the game as much as I could.
So after I heard that GT6 had no car damage I was sooo disappointed but it was whatever. Now with day one micro transactions??
I want this game but so far there is literally no reason for me to buy it. Please... Convince me!

How to convince you when I'm trying to convince myself?

I'm going to buy my copy today. I agree it's a bummer no car damage. But it's not the end of the world. All I want is improved / more intelligent A.I., good competition and I'm hoping for a much improved online. But again back to car damage, if this was in the game especially for online play, it would force people to drive properly / professionally and not always be bumping into you unpurposely

Thats exactly how I feel! I hate how people try to defend this game by saying "Its about racing not destroying cars" I dont understand that? I dont drive on the wrong side of the road just to cause damage, but say I go into a curb too fast and ram into a wall, I then just drive off like it never happened. It is so annoying. I remember after I discovered no car damage in GT5 I drove like an idiot because the game never punishes you for doing so.

 

[LamaBraveheart]

Go to a gamestop they will convince you, while getting the $3 warranty as well

 

[JB-BMW1989]

I definitely go buy it if I were you. This game isn't about the racing or the car crashes, it's the driving. The game goes well with the Driving Force GT wheel by Logitech. For the pros with a high budget, the Thrustmaster T500 RS will go with Gran Turismo 6 nicely.

 

[ZaXoFF7]

First off, the car wash isn't useless. It actually has an effect, albeit a small one. And as for the car damage... to start, the argument that the game is about driving and not crashing stands. Damage is nice, but not essential, as crashing isn't your goal. Damage isn't required for racing unless you're playing Burnout or Destruction Derby; games that are based around crashes. What's more, a lot of the damage in racing games today would often leave you inelegible to continue a race in most real racing leagues, so having damage doesn't necissarily make it more realistic. On top of this, it costs a lot of money to add damage modeling to a game, because of the licensing issues with car manufacturers. They will never be okay with realistic damage modeling, rendering damage modeling in a sim game somewhat useless.

Regarless of all that though, GT5 does indeed have both visual and mechanical damage options when playing online and in Arcade mode (and visual damage in the career). GT6 is the exact same.

As for the microtransactions, both Forza and GT are doing it. But (as far as GT) it's clear that it didn't effect the gameplay for those who don't want to use them. Cars and things are actually slightly more affordable... especially paint chips since they aren't consumable anymore. And Turn 10 is quick to patch Forza 5 so that it doesn't effect their players either. Microtransactions aren't inherently evil, only when they alter the pacing of the game. The pacing of GT6 hasn't been altered, so they don't harm anyone.

If none of that convinces you, then the great UI and physics updates should. The cars feel infinitely more lively and diverse because of the suspension and tire model alterations. The menus are much cleaner, and everything's much quicker. The lighting and skyboxes have been much improved, and many more tracks have weather and time-change. There's all the stuff woody pointed out, as well as the new tracks. The leveling system has been replaced with a much more organic progression. The track creation is going to hopefully be much much improved once all of the planned features are added. There's a lot to love about the updates and refinements of GT6, but it's still best enjoyed by sim enthusiasts who enjoy cars and driving.

I think the only (personal) downside is that there are only half the amount of license tests, and they're significantly easier. But most people probably appreciate that.

Oh, there's also a blind spot indicator, so people don't have to annoy me with their horn in EVERY online race.

 

[woody938]

Damage isn't required for racing unless you're playing Burnout or Destruction Derby; games that are based around crashes.

I tried Burnout Paradise when I got it for free from that PSN incident but couldn't figure out how to advance 'n stuff and gave up, I guess it's because I was trying to drive fast and cleanly.

//doesn't understand the microtransactions

 

[Nas-Escobar]

So far the only thing I dislike is the fact you have 30,000 dollars and they 'force you' to buy the one Honda car as your starting car and locked all of the other cars

 

[ZaXoFF7]

So far the only thing I dislike is the fact you have 30,000 dollars and they 'force you' to buy the one Honda car as your starting car and locked all of the other cars

Welcome to Forza-style hand holding infiltrating other games in the same genre.

 

[woody2goody]

So far the only thing I dislike is the fact you have 30,000 dollars and they 'force you' to buy the one Honda car as your starting car and locked all of the other cars

I agree with that statement at least. I used to like being able to choose my first car. Not a big thing but a tiny bit annoying.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

[ZaXoFF7]

So far the only thing I dislike is the fact you have 30,000 dollars and they 'force you' to buy the one Honda car as your starting car and locked all of the other cars

I agree with that statement at least. I used to like being able to choose my first car. Not a big thing but a tiny bit annoying.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

A second woody?! How... Wha... Ugh... My whole life is a lie!!!

 

[woody2goody]

So far the only thing I dislike is the fact you have 30,000 dollars and they 'force you' to buy the one Honda car as your starting car and locked all of the other cars

I agree with that statement at least. I used to like being able to choose my first car. Not a big thing but a tiny bit annoying.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

A second woody?! How... Wha... Ugh... My whole life is a lie!!!

Haha the illusion is ruined!

 

[woody938]

Yeah, I am too goody

 

[Awong124]

For Goodwood Hill Climb challenges you get an invite from the owner of the course and it is a little challenging to reach the times but the License Tests are easy compared to previous GTs so you won't get stuck white-knuckled with them so badly.

The Goodwood ones aren't difficult to get gold at all. So far I've beaten most of them by like 4 seconds. They're challenging in terms of trying to push as hard as you can, but the gold times are ridiculously generous. If you take it easy you can get gold no problem.

So far the only thing I dislike is the fact you have 30,000 dollars and they 'force you' to buy the one Honda car as your starting car and locked all of the other cars

The Fit actually remains useful for quite a while. I'm still using it for IA 500PP races.

 

[ZaXoFF7]

For Goodwood Hill Climb challenges you get an invite from the owner of the course and it is a little challenging to reach the times but the License Tests are easy compared to previous GTs so you won't get stuck white-knuckled with them so badly.

The Goodwood ones aren't difficult to get gold at all. So far I've beaten most of them by like 4 seconds. They're challenging in terms of trying to push as hard as you can, but the gold times are ridiculously generous. If you take it easy you can get gold no problem.

So far the only thing I dislike is the fact you have 30,000 dollars and they 'force you' to buy the one Honda car as your starting car and locked all of the other cars

The Fit actually remains useful for quite a while. I'm still using it for IA 500PP races.

As far as Goodwood goes, it's not a d**k sizing contest. Just because they're easy for you or me, doesn't mean they're easy for everyone; especially when you look at who has what assists on and off And knowing woody, I'm confident that he didn't really find them difficult, so much as tense. He (like me) probably saw to potential it had to be difficult for less experienced players. That is a thin ass road with some blind ass corners.

And as for the Fit, the issue isn't its usefulness. GT has so many cars for a reason. Part of the fun of the game is personalizing it by choosing the cars you want. Granted, the Fit is only there for tutorial purposes, and only needs to be used once. And, after that race, you basically begin with 20k credits, which is around what you always start with. But the idea is that implementing these sorts of things in an unskipable way is counterproductive when you're a GT veteran. And it and the opening race undermine the beauty of the hard work GT has always gone through to teach their players. It feels too hands on.

 

[Awong124]

Maybe I found it easy because I use a wheel. I seem to recall that Woody uses a DS3.

Goodwood is a very short track with less than 10 actual corners. If you use a wheel as long as you're conservative and don't over drive the car off the track or into the barriers, chances are most of them are pretty easy to get gold on. I honestly think PD meant for them to be as such, when it's possible to beat the gold time by 4 or 5 seconds. So lets not pretend that they're meant to be difficult, or even challenging, when using a reasonable objective time as a metric. On the other hand, if you're trying to push it to the limit and go as quick as you can go, then it is challenging. A lot of those are challenging to just keep the car on the road if you're pushing flat out. But the gold time is far from challenging for the most part. It has potential to be challenging if the gold times for most of those were reduced by 2 seconds, I think that would be pretty reasonable. Gold should be an achievement, not something handed to you, or something every Tom Dick and Harry could obtain without a lot of practice (which seems to be what PD is going for with GT6). But maybe they had to be generous with the times to accommodate DS3 users, since the physics has made it much more difficult to use a gamepad since GT5.

The Fit is actually pretty nice to drive, so I continued using it.

 

[ZaXoFF7]

No, it's not the wheel. I haven't even touched a wheel since Need For Speed 2 in '98 or whenever that was (I will only settle for a T500, with its fancy clutch, feedback capabilities, and the H-shifter... But thats like $750...), and I found Gold easy on the Goodwood events. But I also regularly landed in the top 3000 on the Seasonal leaderboards on GT5 without any effort. You have to remember that we're skilled players. GT6 seems a bit more lenient than previous games (especially a few of the GT5 Special Events), but having gone back all the way to GT2 regularly, I know that they're not THAT much more lenient. I've just gotten better. Back even five years ago, the Goodwood challenges would have been a major challenge.

 

[woody2goody]

For what it's worth I'm a pad user and have always found GT's handling and difficulty to be spot on.

These days with seasonal events I just like to challenge myself with a car I like. I'm not bothered if I don't win because the PP bonus will be decent

How are you finding the general difficulty in career mode championships?

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

[ZaXoFF7]

I'm finding the difficulty in championships much more challenging than GT5. It's partially the evil AI pit maneuvers, partially that I'm actually trying to be competitive unlike GT5, and largely because 6 actually holds you to the stipulations of the race. Often times in GT5, they had a type of race (say MR only), and they didn't actually enforce it. I remember using an F1 car in one of the Hot Hatch championships, just because it would let me. And they inforce PP limits much more in 6, though I'm usually way under the limit.

I have noticed one thing though. It seems that the top cars seem to slow way down on the last lap; I can't recall if they did this in the career of 5. As an example, I was on Brands Hatch in the National A-NA Sports Series, and at the beginning of the back straight (second out of three laps), I was 10 seconds behind. By the end of the straight, I was 13 seconds behind. One lap later, I was ahead by 1.6 seconds in the same spot. After that, I started noticing that this was happening almost every race. I wish they would finally implement difficulty levels. The AI constantly brakes way too early -which not only makes them slower-, but it also gets in the way of my extremely late braking.

So overall, it's challenging me more, but I wouldn't call it difficult by any means, unless your car is really stunted compared to your competitors.

I have a friend though whose not terribly good, and he's finding more than enough challenge.

 

[Awong124]

The AI cars slow down to let you catch up. There are threads in GTPlanet that discuss this. Rubber banding is in full effect in career mode, much more prevalent than in GT5.

 

[woody938]

I have difficulty with Goodwood because my eyes have a hard time distinguishing between the tarmac and the grass so I have a really hard time distinguishing the "barriers" of the course, especially when lighting changes and in that dark shadowed area.

 

[GTporsche]

I've got decent eyes, and I was having trouble finding where the road ended and the grass began in certain areas.

 

[Awong124]

It's hard to tell where the road goes coming out of that dark right-left part. To me it always looks like it curves more to the left than it actually does.

 

[ZaXoFF7]

I guess I just have good muscle memory, because I picked the track up nearly perfectly after like two runs. It's a little hard for me to tell what's going on though, if only because I'm using an aging SD TV and composite instead of component.

My two trouble sections are the sweeping corner in the beginning where the bails of hay cut onto the track on the inside, and the final corner, that leads back into the umbrage and toward the finish. That final corner rarely needs anything but full throttle. But there are those few vehicles that need a touch of braking, and that always throws me off the first run or two. As for the sweeper, you're just exiting a straight, so you're going pretty fast. And the entrance to the corner is somewhat obscured (the exit being a complete mystery at that point). It always requires hard braking, but the issue is how much. I don't know why, but it's a corner that I just can't judge well. There are only a few corners in the other new tracks that give me trouble, but that one at Goodwood throws me off once in at least every vehicle I use. And it's all just because the required braking distances vastly change for each vehicle you do it in. I think that little flick to the right at the very entrance to the corner does it, because it makes it impossible to brake in a straight line; you'll hit the inside grass.

 

[woody938]

I always do a "manual abs" braking style where turning and especially direction change is required, that said, it took me a while to figure out the rough braking point and shape of that corner, I still get nervous accelerating out of it in case I get on the grass.

 

[Class_of_99]

Honestly I don't know how to. The racing setup is not that fun which surprises because Kaz races cars. This series needs proper qualifying and grid startsm and to get away from the chase-the-rabbit thing they got. The AI still sucks too.

 

[woody938]

I do miss standing starts.

 

[GTporsche]

I was surprised that, at least, the Jr. Kart races had standing starts.

 

[Awong124]

I was surprised that, at least, the Jr. Kart races had standing starts.

And you also don't start dead last for a change.

 

[Awong124]

Goodwood 5-3 with the Red Bull X2010 is hilarious. It's so fast it looks like it's in fast motion. Watching the replay is like watching Benny Hill or something.

 

[woody938]

Cue theme song

 

[GTporsche]

I like the changes to the Red Bull. The sound is a large improvement and the car isn't as tricky to drive this time around. Although, Goodwood is very narrow, so there's that.

 

[Awong124]

I like the changes to the Red Bull. The sound is a large improvement and the car isn't as tricky to drive this time around. Although, Goodwood is very narrow, so there's that.

They did make the gold time ridiculously generous for that particular one. It's probably supposed to be the most difficult challenge, but I beat the gold time by even more than any of the other Goodwood ones. And when the gold time is only 31 seconds, the margin percentage-wise is huge.

 

[GTporsche]

I like the changes to the Red Bull. The sound is a large improvement and the car isn't as tricky to drive this time around. Although, Goodwood is very narrow, so there's that.

They did make the gold time ridiculously generous for that particular one. It's probably supposed to be the most difficult challenge, but I beat the gold time by even more than any of the other Goodwood ones. And when the gold time is only 31 seconds, the margin percentage-wise is huge.

Yeah. I think I set a time of 28ish seconds on a very sloppy, conservative run.

 

[Class_of_99]

After having spent the weekend with it, I can definitely say that

-Its the same old stale formula
-Not enough new cars or tracks were truly added
-The racing formula (if you can call it that) has become a chase-the-rabbit situation. This isn't racing....
-The AI was not improved..
-This feels like GT5.5, not a whole new game.

Kaz seriously does not understand how to make a racing game at this point, but of course the GT fanboys will say he's not making a racing game, that its more.

The game is getting low sales, and it deserves it.

 

[Awong124]

After having spent the weekend with it, I can definitely say that

-Its the same old stale formula
-Not enough new cars or tracks were truly added
-The racing formula (if you can call it that) has become a chase-the-rabbit situation. This isn't racing....
-The AI was not improved..
-This feels like GT5.5, not a whole new game.

Kaz seriously does not understand how to make a racing game at this point, but of course the GT fanboys will say he's not making a racing game, that its more.

The game is getting low sales, and it deserves it.

That's pretty much exactly my first impressions with it as well. But on the bright side, looking through the trophies, this is probably the first game I'm ever going to platinum. The trophies are all relatively easy to get compared any other game I've played, and look very doable without spending an insane amount of time on.

 

[ZaXoFF7]

After having spent the weekend with it, I can definitely say that

-Its the same old stale formula
-Not enough new cars or tracks were truly added
-The racing formula (if you can call it that) has become a chase-the-rabbit situation. This isn't racing....
-The AI was not improved..
-This feels like GT5.5, not a whole new game.

Kaz seriously does not understand how to make a racing game at this point, but of course the GT fanboys will say he's not making a racing game, that its more.

The game is getting low sales, and it deserves it.

Even though I'm sure to be labeled a fanboy, I'm going to rebut this argument as best as I can.

1. The formula being stale depends on the player, and is in fact an opinion. I personally like the simplicity of the GT career formula. Could it be improved? Yes. For example, I personally wish we could take a B-Spec driver and use them as a team member, similar to Grid; but being a B-Spec driver, it would be a bit more in depth than Grid, which just uses your teammate in a one dimensional manner... Get a driver, use him until the races step it up, fire him, and repeat with a higher level driver. Using a modified version of the B-Spec driver system in GT5 would allow for a completely optional RPG style team building mechanic to help you win races and earn money. Imagine being able to give commands like NFS Carbon or something. But regardless, from a functional standpoint, the current formula is well made and doesn't require being changed. Nothing gets in your way, like it can in most other racing games. It does what it sets out to do.

2. There were more new cars and tracks added here than there is on average in every other racing series that gets a sequel (referring to games that have track lists, and don't rely entirely on fictional racing arenas). And besides, it's not the quantity, it's the quality. GT continues to add popular tracks, as well as create arguably the most well made fictional tracks. As for the cars, lets compare this with Forza for a second.

GT6 added about 200 cars at launch. Forza 5 only has about 200 total, around 75% of which aren't new. And most racing games with large rosters hardly include more than 75 to 100 cars. Even taking out the padding, GT6 has around 750 entirely unique vehicles, which is more than any other racing game to date.

3. I'll give you the issue with standing starts. Because the AI doesn't have difficulty levels, PD doesn't use standing starts. With the AI as it is, you would pass the entire grid within the first turn or two using a standing start. They simply brake too late and accelerate too slowly. But standing starts are included online, and now with qualifying rounds to boot. It's obviously still a form or racing, they just need others to break up the monotony.

4. The AI was improved in some ways, but it does indeed lack in others. But this will take some fine tuning. They can't use the same route as Forza 5 with the Driveatar thing, because the PS3 can't do that (and don't even pretend it should've been on PS4 instead; there are plenty of good reasons as to why it isn't). And most PC sims are multiplayer only, and don't include AI... The ones that do, are usually lacking because PC sims like to focus on trivial things like the player controlling their car in pit lane. The AI in GT5 was better than both Forza 3 and 4 at launch, because it could exploit the PS3 architecture which was more powerful. Forza focused on single-minded AI gimmicks to give the impression that their AI was more advanced. That's not bashing Turn 10; they did what they could. But the cell-processor, and game utility option of the PS3 allowed for more genuine AI that got significantly better with updates.

GT6 seems to have taken a small step backward from the most recent GT5 AI patterns, but I have no doubt that it will be fixed extremely quickly.

In the end, I would give GT6 an 8 out of 10 as of now. It has flaws, but I have no doubt that it will become an entirely different beast in the ensuing months. And yes, GT isn't just a racing game. It isn't something MORE than a racing game, it's something DIFFERENT. It truly is more accurate to color it a driving simulator. It's about the love of automobiles as a whole, not about the gold trophy. That's why it has many quirky cars, concepts, and strange minigames. That's why it has a photo mode, and GT5 had a museum of cards showcasing cars that had nothing to do with racing. That's why you can drive things like the Daimler-Mercedes Motor Carriage, and a Moon Rover. PD invests themselves in car culture. That's why they teamed with Nike to make that Nike car in GT4, and worked with Red Bull for the X2010. That's why they designed the interface for the LCD screen in the GT-R, and we're getting the Vision GT cars. That's why we get early concepts for cars, and digital recreations of tuned masterpieces from SEMA and Pebble Beach, lovingly built by people working in from garages. Name another racing game developer that's THAT in tune with the world of car culture. Sure from a gameplay standpoint, GT has its flaws just like any other game that tries to reach for such a high bar. If you really look at the staggering amount of work in the games, it's amazing we even get as polished of a product as we do. But PD does one thing that no other racing game design team does, and that's truly cater to car enthusiasts first, and racing game enthusiasts second. And I believe it reaches that goal to a very admirable degree. If you're looking for a racing game first, and a driving sim for car enthusiasts second, maybe this just isn't your series.

And PD doesn't have to cater to the racing game enthusiast crowd first. In a world like we have today, where games like Gone Home, Anna, The Stanley Parable, Heavy Rain, CoD, Journey, Halo, Katamari Damacy, and Forza call all coexist as entirely different types of games with entirely different goals, why does GT have to cater to gamers first, let alone at all?

 

[GTporsche]

Yeah, the trophies for GT6 are much easier than GT5, and I should know since I have the platinum for GT5.

 

[Class_of_99]

After having spent the weekend with it, I can definitely say that

-Its the same old stale formula
-Not enough new cars or tracks were truly added
-The racing formula (if you can call it that) has become a chase-the-rabbit situation. This isn't racing....
-The AI was not improved..
-This feels like GT5.5, not a whole new game.

Kaz seriously does not understand how to make a racing game at this point, but of course the GT fanboys will say he's not making a racing game, that its more.

The game is getting low sales, and it deserves it.

Even though I'm sure to be labeled a fanboy, I'm going to rebut this argument as best as I can.

1. The formula being stale depends on the player, and is in fact an opinion. I personally like the simplicity of the GT career formula. Could it be improved? Yes. For example, I personally wish we could take a B-Spec driver and use them as a team member, similar to Grid; but being a B-Spec driver, it would be a bit more in depth than Grid, which just uses your teammate in a one dimensional manner... Get a driver, use him until the races step it up, fire him, and repeat with a higher level driver. Using a modified version of the B-Spec driver system in GT5 would allow for a completely optional RPG style team building mechanic to help you win races and earn money. Imagine being able to give commands like NFS Carbon or something. But regardless, from a functional standpoint, the current formula is well made and doesn't require being changed. Nothing gets in your way, like it can in most other racing games. It does what it sets out to do.

2. There were more new cars and tracks added here than there is on average in every other racing series that gets a sequel (referring to games that have track lists, and don't rely entirely on fictional racing arenas). And besides, it's not the quantity, it's the quality. GT continues to add popular tracks, as well as create arguably the most well made fictional tracks. As for the cars, lets compare this with Forza for a second.

GT6 added about 200 cars at launch. Forza 5 only has about 200 total, around 75% of which aren't new. And most racing games with large rosters hardly include more than 75 to 100 cars. Even taking out the padding, GT6 has around 750 entirely unique vehicles, which is more than any other racing game to date.

3. I'll give you the issue with standing starts. Because the AI doesn't have difficulty levels, PD doesn't use standing starts. With the AI as it is, you would pass the entire grid within the first turn or two using a standing start. They simply brake too late and accelerate too slowly. But standing starts are included online, and now with qualifying rounds to boot. It's obviously still a form or racing, they just need others to break up the monotony.

4. The AI was improved in some ways, but it does indeed lack in others. But this will take some fine tuning. They can't use the same route as Forza 5 with the Driveatar thing, because the PS3 can't do that (and don't even pretend it should've been on PS4 instead; there are plenty of good reasons as to why it isn't). And most PC sims are multiplayer only, and don't include AI... The ones that do, are usually lacking because PC sims like to focus on trivial things like the player controlling their car in pit lane. The AI in GT5 was better than both Forza 3 and 4 at launch, because it could exploit the PS3 architecture which was more powerful. Forza focused on single-minded AI gimmicks to give the impression that their AI was more advanced. That's not bashing Turn 10; they did what they could. But the cell-processor, and game utility option of the PS3 allowed for more genuine AI that got significantly better with updates.

GT6 seems to have taken a small step backward from the most recent GT5 AI patterns, but I have no doubt that it will be fixed extremely quickly.

In the end, I would give GT6 an 8 out of 10 as of now. It has flaws, but I have no doubt that it will become an entirely different beast in the ensuing months. And yes, GT isn't just a racing game. It isn't something MORE than a racing game, it's something DIFFERENT. It truly is more accurate to color it a driving simulator. It's about the love of automobiles as a whole, not about the gold trophy. That's why it has many quirky cars, concepts, and strange minigames. That's why it has a photo mode, and GT5 had a museum of cards showcasing cars that had nothing to do with racing. That's why you can drive things like the Daimler-Mercedes Motor Carriage, and a Moon Rover. PD invests themselves in car culture. That's why they teamed with Nike to make that Nike car in GT4, and worked with Red Bull for the X2010. That's why they designed the interface for the LCD screen in the GT-R, and we're getting the Vision GT cars. That's why we get early concepts for cars, and digital recreations of tuned masterpieces from SEMA and Pebble Beach, lovingly built by people working in from garages. Name another racing game developer that's THAT in tune with the world of car culture. Sure from a gameplay standpoint, GT has its flaws just like any other game that tries to reach for such a high bar. If you really look at the staggering amount of work in the games, it's amazing we even get as polished of a product as we do. But PD does one thing that no other racing game design team does, and that's truly cater to car enthusiasts first, and racing game enthusiasts second. And I believe it reaches that goal to a very admirable degree. If you're looking for a racing game first, and a driving sim for car enthusiasts second, maybe this just isn't your series.

And PD doesn't have to cater to the racing game enthusiast crowd first. In a world like we have today, where games like Gone Home, Anna, The Stanley Parable, Heavy Rain, CoD, Journey, Halo, Katamari Damacy, and Forza call all coexist as entirely different types of games with entirely different goals, why does GT have to cater to gamers first, let alone at all?

I still think Codemasters has better AI in their games, and has chosen better tracks for their games in the past. It's subjective I know, but I think even the courses PD has chosen to replicate have been bad. Throwing this out there but all time favourite tracklist will always be TOCA3 on the PS2.

It's not a driving simulator because it is trying to put you into racing situations and time trials. You may try to say differently to defend it, but don't you agree giving GT a racing feeling is easily within the realm of whats already there, and what has been in the past? This game used to have qualis and standing starts, there was no reason to change it. My problem is that it can easily be BOTH. I play flgiht sims that allow for both the recreation of flying and competitive flying in the same package. Every other racing game allows you to drive cars in tiem trials however you want, but then set up the racing side right.

 

[SerGiggles]

DriveClub > GT

 

[Awong124]

After having spent the weekend with it, I can definitely say that

-Its the same old stale formula
-Not enough new cars or tracks were truly added
-The racing formula (if you can call it that) has become a chase-the-rabbit situation. This isn't racing....
-The AI was not improved..
-This feels like GT5.5, not a whole new game.

Kaz seriously does not understand how to make a racing game at this point, but of course the GT fanboys will say he's not making a racing game, that its more.

The game is getting low sales, and it deserves it.

Even though I'm sure to be labeled a fanboy, I'm going to rebut this argument as best as I can.

1. The formula being stale depends on the player, and is in fact an opinion. I personally like the simplicity of the GT career formula. Could it be improved? Yes. For example, I personally wish we could take a B-Spec driver and use them as a team member, similar to Grid; but being a B-Spec driver, it would be a bit more in depth than Grid, which just uses your teammate in a one dimensional manner... Get a driver, use him until the races step it up, fire him, and repeat with a higher level driver. Using a modified version of the B-Spec driver system in GT5 would allow for a completely optional RPG style team building mechanic to help you win races and earn money. Imagine being able to give commands like NFS Carbon or something. But regardless, from a functional standpoint, the current formula is well made and doesn't require being changed. Nothing gets in your way, like it can in most other racing games. It does what it sets out to do.

2. There were more new cars and tracks added here than there is on average in every other racing series that gets a sequel (referring to games that have track lists, and don't rely entirely on fictional racing arenas). And besides, it's not the quantity, it's the quality. GT continues to add popular tracks, as well as create arguably the most well made fictional tracks. As for the cars, lets compare this with Forza for a second.

GT6 added about 200 cars at launch. Forza 5 only has about 200 total, around 75% of which aren't new. And most racing games with large rosters hardly include more than 75 to 100 cars. Even taking out the padding, GT6 has around 750 entirely unique vehicles, which is more than any other racing game to date.

3. I'll give you the issue with standing starts. Because the AI doesn't have difficulty levels, PD doesn't use standing starts. With the AI as it is, you would pass the entire grid within the first turn or two using a standing start. They simply brake too late and accelerate too slowly. But standing starts are included online, and now with qualifying rounds to boot. It's obviously still a form or racing, they just need others to break up the monotony.

4. The AI was improved in some ways, but it does indeed lack in others. But this will take some fine tuning. They can't use the same route as Forza 5 with the Driveatar thing, because the PS3 can't do that (and don't even pretend it should've been on PS4 instead; there are plenty of good reasons as to why it isn't). And most PC sims are multiplayer only, and don't include AI... The ones that do, are usually lacking because PC sims like to focus on trivial things like the player controlling their car in pit lane. The AI in GT5 was better than both Forza 3 and 4 at launch, because it could exploit the PS3 architecture which was more powerful. Forza focused on single-minded AI gimmicks to give the impression that their AI was more advanced. That's not bashing Turn 10; they did what they could. But the cell-processor, and game utility option of the PS3 allowed for more genuine AI that got significantly better with updates.

GT6 seems to have taken a small step backward from the most recent GT5 AI patterns, but I have no doubt that it will be fixed extremely quickly.

In the end, I would give GT6 an 8 out of 10 as of now. It has flaws, but I have no doubt that it will become an entirely different beast in the ensuing months. And yes, GT isn't just a racing game. It isn't something MORE than a racing game, it's something DIFFERENT. It truly is more accurate to color it a driving simulator. It's about the love of automobiles as a whole, not about the gold trophy. That's why it has many quirky cars, concepts, and strange minigames. That's why it has a photo mode, and GT5 had a museum of cards showcasing cars that had nothing to do with racing. That's why you can drive things like the Daimler-Mercedes Motor Carriage, and a Moon Rover. PD invests themselves in car culture. That's why they teamed with Nike to make that Nike car in GT4, and worked with Red Bull for the X2010. That's why they designed the interface for the LCD screen in the GT-R, and we're getting the Vision GT cars. That's why we get early concepts for cars, and digital recreations of tuned masterpieces from SEMA and Pebble Beach, lovingly built by people working in from garages. Name another racing game developer that's THAT in tune with the world of car culture. Sure from a gameplay standpoint, GT has its flaws just like any other game that tries to reach for such a high bar. If you really look at the staggering amount of work in the games, it's amazing we even get as polished of a product as we do. But PD does one thing that no other racing game design team does, and that's truly cater to car enthusiasts first, and racing game enthusiasts second. And I believe it reaches that goal to a very admirable degree. If you're looking for a racing game first, and a driving sim for car enthusiasts second, maybe this just isn't your series.

And PD doesn't have to cater to the racing game enthusiast crowd first. In a world like we have today, where games like Gone Home, Anna, The Stanley Parable, Heavy Rain, CoD, Journey, Halo, Katamari Damacy, and Forza call all coexist as entirely different types of games with entirely different goals, why does GT have to cater to gamers first, let alone at all?

I still think Codemasters has better AI in their games, and has chosen better tracks for their games in the past. It's subjective I know, but I think even the courses PD has chosen to replicate have been bad. Throwing this out there but all time favourite tracklist will always be TOCA3 on the PS2.

It's not a driving simulator because it is trying to put you into racing situations and time trials. You may try to say differently to defend it, but don't you agree giving GT a racing feeling is easily within the realm of whats already there, and what has been in the past? This game used to have qualis and standing starts, there was no reason to change it. My problem is that it can easily be BOTH. I play flgiht sims that allow for both the recreation of flying and competitive flying in the same package. Every other racing game allows you to drive cars in tiem trials however you want, but then set up the racing side right.

Yeah, the AI in Codemaster's F1 games are incredible. They were still a little bit slow in the previous installment, but act very lifelike most of the time. Those F1 games are probably the best racing games I've ever played against AI opponents.

I think I would actually rather have qualifying and standing starts, and lead the entire race from start to finish than the current chase the rabbit. It would at least seem like actual racing format, instead of basically just avoiding slower cars, especially when they're stupid. I also harbor some resentment towards the current format in that I don't feel it's fair. Why should I always have to automatically start at the back? It's kind of an irrational feeling given that it's just the way the game is designed, and the cars in front are meant to be slower, but I still feel that way and I hate it.

DriveClub > GT

It's not out yet is it? I was pretty excited about it at first, but I'm not that interested in it anymore after seeing all the promo and it seems like it's mostly racing on mountain roads and stuff. I'm not interested in that kind of thing. If when it actually comes out and there's more racing on actual race tracks, then I'll consider it.

 

[Class_of_99]

Also just going to add this, Kaz and his team showed how little they understand NASCAR by their choice of ovals in this game. They needed to atleast add a short track to give the oval racing some variety. It just bugs me because so much of the promotion/marketing of this game is about racing. I mean, they even sponsor a contest to find the next race car driver, yet their game does a horrible job of it. I was really hoping for something like Martinsville or Bristol.
-

 

[mr_pops238]

Get GT6. Its a massive improvement over GT5.

-Load times are super short now/faster menus.
-Great career mode. It actually feels long. Tons more races. This feels as big as GT4 was. This is what GT5 should have been.
-Improved graphics.
-Better online.
-Weather day/night cycle which is really cool to watch.
-Moon missions were actually fun.
-License tests are easier(Which I think is a great thing)
-Photo mode is back if your into that thing. They got some great levels to take pics in.
-No B-spec mode yet, but they plan on adding it in later on. Personally, I don't care if it's there or not.
-No more dumb experience points/leveling to 40
-Trophies are much easier to get this time.
-Go karts have improved physics/they don't suck this time like they did in GT5.
-More challenges/races/gimmicky stuff like knocking over cones, drifting and missions are back. These are nice fun break from racing all the time.

 

[ZaXoFF7]

I believe the racing aspect of GT is due in large part simply to expectations of fans from a bygone age. Back when GT started, classification of what was a game was a lot more shallow. It was in that awkward stage where we all finally understood what a game could be, but we then chose to close down and say that games had to be this, this, and this to be good. What's more, a driving sim can still use racing as its crux and not be a pure racing game. What else can they do? Make a game that has hundreds of cars with objectiveless random open environments to drive in? You can't spend hundreds of millions of dollars on developement of a game like that. Not only would it not sell easily, but fanboys would see it as a betrayal, ensuring the downfall of the series.

As for Codemasters, yes they do indeed have great AI. Grid 1 is my favorite sim-cade game due to its atmosphere and dynamic nature. But that's not a fair comparison. Codemasters AI relies on its insane rubber banding as the balance point. If you think rubber banding in GT6 (which I believe shouldn't be in a sim game at all) is strong, Codemasters rubber banding is way stronger. It's masked quite a bit better than in GT, but that's because the AI is designed to look dynamic and human first, and drive well second. You have a hard time seeing the underlying systems, because the end product is so unpredictable. But regardless, Codemasters AI generally works on systems that would be broken if put in a game like GT. GT could still learn something from them, but as I said before, their AI is a lot more advanced than people give them credit for. It's hard to make sim AI work well, because the line between competent AI and fun dynamism is a lot thinner, and rubber banding couldn't/shouldn't be used to widen said line.

 

[woody938]

Aside from the Moon Missions the most fun I've had so far was on Kart Space course racing 100CC karts, that was kinda challenging and I don't think I coulda won without changing my gear ratio down to improve acceleration. It certainly is the race I've repeated most so far. I'm looking forward to racing the 125CC 6-speed kart.

 

[Bonemeal2pointOh]

I'm gonna add a question to this thread. I think it fits.

I rented GT-5 from GameFly, and the copy I got is in pristine condition. I can "keep" it for $15, and with my $5 of GameFly bucks, I'd get it for $10. Should I drop 10 bones on GT-5 or just hold out until I can afford GT-6? Not sure exactly when I'll be able to buy GT-6. I'm shooting for somewhere in the next three months.

So...$10 for GT-5. Worth it?

 

[ZaXoFF7]

I'm gonna add a question to this thread. I think it fits.

I rented GT-5 from GameFly, and the copy I got is in pristine condition. I can "keep" it for $15, and with my $5 of GameFly bucks, I'd get it for $10. Should I drop 10 bones on GT-5 or just hold out until I can afford GT-6? Not sure exactly when I'll be able to buy GT-6. I'm shooting for somewhere in the next three months.

So...$10 for GT-5. Worth it?

I'd say it's worth it. The game has more than enough content to tide someone over for quite a while, and it's definitely worth more than $10. However, I believe you can find said game used from GameStop for like $7. And since it's really difficult to damage a BluRay, you're almost guaranteed a prestine copy there too. The game is worth it though. Online still functions, and it has oodles of added content from free updates. Be warned though, even without installing the optional 8 gig game utility, there are still at least 3+ gigs of updates you'll need to download.

 

[floridaboy96]

Are the load times still really long?