So they really are going to shut down Strasburg
- Thread starter LetsGoMets89
- Start date
![[face_tired]](https://cdn.statically.io/img/www.ignboards.com/styles/ign/ign/smilies/classic/tired.gif "Tired [face_tired]")
BigDan245
Super Star
slap in the face to the fans
- Nov 19, 2000
- 50,937
- 14,146
Yup. Honestly, that's not even the worst of it. Even if they didn't shut him down they would be only be pitching him every 5th day. They should be pitching him every other day at this point.
This is genuinely one of the most bizarre moves a baseball team has ever made.
ThunderFist17
No Longer a Noob
Hey guiz, listen I know we're having our first winning season since...........Damn since when? Anyway I know a lot of you are mad we're shutting down Strausburg but we can't throw away the future for a silly playoff run, after all we are the Nats we do get those like every year.
This is so dumb. Shut him down now, if you're going to bother doing so at all, then bring him back for the playoffs. You're not going to hurt him by giving him time off during the season -- hell, if he had elbow soreness or something, he'd be prescribed in-season time off, and nobody would bat an eye when he returned. This makes no sense at all.
Strasburg has his maximum value in the postseason, and you're going to shut him down for that part of the season but let him pitch the rest? Da fuq?
Strasburg has his maximum value in the postseason, and you're going to shut him down for that part of the season but let him pitch the rest? Da fuq?
Last edited:
BigDan245
Super Star
Nationals had no intentions of ever competing this...Even with the best record in baseball they don't care about winning...They'd rather "save" him for the future than go all in this year. I put save in quotations because who the hell knows how long this guy will pitch for. You never know with shoulders and arm...He could get hurt in spring training next season. Teams have gotten so cautious with guys that they aren't even maximizing their careers.
Completely asinine.
- Feb 10, 2009
- 76,713
- 19,072
I'm pretty sure that a few former pitchers have already said that shutting him down completely might actually do more damage to his arm than shutting him down for a month or so and then letting him pitch in the playoffs would. The former is basically going to force Strasburg to rebuild his arm strength next season after a bigger break than pitchers are used to while the latter would just be like a DL-stint.
Last edited:
A title and a shredded elbow > No title and 2 world series losses.
Or basically shit happens and you can't ever guarantee you get another shot.
Or basically shit happens and you can't ever guarantee you get another shot.
I made this point in the thread a month ago, and Yahoo Sports had the feature today on it. The CWS and how they handled Sale in keeping him around for playoffs is what the Nationals should have done. Basically, the CWS have sprinkled some 9 day rest periods in for Sale during the season.
Last edited:
Flat out the dumbest decision I have ever seen
- Feb 9, 2011
- 17,091
- 19,661
I want to have faith that the Nationals brass will find some intelligent way around this - a phantom D.L. stint, a few abbreviated starts (75-pitch limit or so), an expanded rotation in September (which would allow Zimmermann and Gonzalez some extra rest, as well) - but it really does seem that they're determined to shut him down.Sadly, this article all but removes any shred of doubt that this will happen.
What bothers me the most about this is that Davey Johnson apparently never got the memo. Why did Strasburg throw 104 pitches in a game the Nationals won 9-1 on Friday? Why did he have to labor through 103 pitches in hot weather when he didn't have his best stuff on July 20? There's plenty of support for bringing a pitcher back slowly ... but it's ass backwards to claim you're doing so to protect his arm when starts like this are the norm.
What bothers me the most about this is that Davey Johnson apparently never got the memo. Why did Strasburg throw 104 pitches in a game the Nationals won 9-1 on Friday? Why did he have to labor through 103 pitches in hot weather when he didn't have his best stuff on July 20? There's plenty of support for bringing a pitcher back slowly ... but it's ass backwards to claim you're doing so to protect his arm when starts like this are the norm.
So the handful of posters on a video game website know more about Strasburgs arm and what to do with it then trained professionals who do it for a living.
Got it
Got it
- Feb 9, 2011
- 17,091
- 19,661
Logic like this is asinine at best.
You do realize that there are plenty of scouts, coaches, and players - former and current - arguing that what the Nationals are doing is inane, right? And decades worth of data indicating that it is very, very difficult (if not impossible) to project if and when a pitcher's arm is going to give? And that there are decades worth of data indicating that winning the World Series this year, or having a deep playoff run, will do more to bolster the team's revenue than saving Strasburg for next year?
All of that ignores any opinion-driven argument that I would make for or against the Nationals' plan in this matter. Regardless, is it really difficult to believe that Strasburg and his teammates don't really like this plan? That it could make any of them a little loath to sign an extension?
And if you really want to play the "trained professionals" card, what makes these Nationals any better than the turn of the century Cubs staff? Plenty of pitchers have gone on to have perfectly productive and healthy careers despite being ridden like Seattle Slew from the moment they turned pro - are Mark Prior and Kerry Wood (who had injury issues far before Dusty Baker) enough to overcome that? Hell, Carlos Zambrano went six years and some 1200 IP between arm issues, averaging about 176 IP per season (with many starts missed due to his insanity) ... and he came up in the same circumstances as those two.
Last edited:
I still don't get why they don't "save" his innings by limiting his innings per start, that way he could theoretically "last" the whole season while still having a total innings limit. Then increase it a bit more next year. All they'd need is a decent long reliever to pull it off.
For example, keep him to 5 innings through April and May, maybe 6 in June and July, then maybe bump to 7 in August and September if he can handle it.
For example, keep him to 5 innings through April and May, maybe 6 in June and July, then maybe bump to 7 in August and September if he can handle it.
Very true. There's also some unknown scrub by the name of Roy Halladay, he's been DLed in his career but never with arm problems.
Last edited:
Prior was predetermined to get hurt, it was in his mechanics. It had nothing to do with how he got worked. All in saying is you guys seriously need to tone it down thinking you know more then Nationals management does, because you don't no matter how many words you type on an IGN message board
Also for the record I also agree that's it's stupid as fuck to shut him down, but they would know better then you or I do and that's just fact
Easy for you to say considering you're the only one who's said that so far. Sdevito, Zelda, etc have been giving their professional opinions with years and years of workin in professional baseball.
Also lmao youre acting like the nationals aren't reading these same things too. Or is all o this coming from your own personal inside source into the MLB?
It's not that they're trying to save his arm that's stupid. Good on them, looking out for their young pitcher's health. It's how they're going about it that's absolutely confusing. They've imposed a strict innings limit for him on the season, where it doesn't matter how he gets there, once he hits that number he's done. As if going beyond it by any measure is going to magically break his arm forever. Which even then, fine. But if that's the case, they're saying don't let him go out and rack up innings in a handful of starts when you can save him for when it matters in the playoffs by limiting his innings now.
The Nationals brass probably is reading this stuff, but they've decided they know what's best. And if they weren't in contention, it would be a fine idea. But they're leading all of baseball, and have pretty much all but wrapped up a playoff berth. They should be smart enough to reconsider their plans for one of their best pitchers so as to include him in their run. Don't mortgage the future, yeah, but good god at least try to win now when it's RIGHT THERE.
What a joke.
I never knew they worked in professional baseball.
They don't
And to the other guy I already said I agreed that it was a dumb idea but I also won't sit here and act like I know better then they do
And to the other guy I already said I agreed that it was a dumb idea but I also won't sit here and act like I know better then they do
- Nov 19, 2000
- 50,937
- 14,146
So no only did you completely fail to understand my posts but then you go on to say this gem...
So you are saying you know they know more than you but you are still going to call their decision dumb? Way to completely straddle the fence and back track because you can't back up your opinion.
You did nothing but give your opinion on the subject, whig happen to be the same as mine. But obviously in not aroun his arm everyday like they are so again like I said, they would know better then me or you or anyone else on a video game message board. You say I'm not understanding you but you're just straight up choosing not to listen to me because you have a sweet gladiator icon
royals_fan_16
Come on you WIZ
- Feb 24, 2003
- 26,617
- 368
His career is more important than one season.
Last edited:
Man, the Ignore feature on the new board system is so damn useful.
What's really going to happen is that the Nationals are going to make it all the way to the World Series without him and face the Yankees. A back and forth series goes all the way to Game 7 in DC with Edwin Jackson starting against CC Sabathia. Jackson gets chased after two innings and the Yankees are up 9-0. The Nationals have to burn through their entire bullpen and starters until Gio Gonzalez enters the game at the top of the 8th with two days rest. He pitches a scoreless frame and that's when shit gets real. The Nationals manage to score 9 runs in the bottom of the eight. Gio goes back out but after a few pitches, it's clear to see something is wrong as he walks the first two and then as he throws a curveball, his arm gives out and he hits Ichiro. The trainers come out and Davey Johnson paces back and forth as there is no one left in the bullpen. Just then, he quickly hops down into the clubhouse and then comes running out, telling the trainers to stall. As the umpires finally tell the trainers and Gonzalez to leave the mound, the crowd turns silent as Thunderstruck pounds through the stadium PA. The bullpen doors open, and from them appears a tall and gangly man with unusually high socks. He takes a second, and then runs out into the field to a standing ovation as he is none other than Stephen Strasburg. He takes to the mound without addressing any of his teammates and warms up as if nothing was strange. As his back is to home, he hears the ump behind the plate telling him he can't be out there and Joe Girardi complaining from the Yankee dugout that this was highly illegal. Strasburg smirks, picks up the ball, turns around back to home and delivers a 105mph fastball which glances off the hairs of the nose of the umpire, richocets off the backstop, and heads towards the New York dugout where the balls ends up smashing Girardi in the skull. Strasburg stands there and mouths "play ball" as Derek Jeter cautiously walks towards the plate.
He strikes out Jeter and Granderson, both on three pitches, all fastballs and up steps up Alex Rodriguez with 2 outs and the bases loaded. A-Rod had been absolutely killing the ball the entire series, and already had 4 RBIs in the game. Strasburg spits, and stares him down. The first two pitches are high inside fastballs, both of which nearly hit A-Rod. He goes back in the zone making him whiff on two straight heaters. He attempts to break off a curve for the strikeout but releases the ball awkwardly sending it into the stands as he yells in pain. He falls over the mound, shrieking, writhing in pain as the trainers jump out of the dugout to attend to him. "STOP", he yells, sending the entire stadium into a hush. He gathers himself, and stands up as the crowd stands and cheers with him. He dusts himself off, sets, and stares right back at A-Rod, looking to strike him out on 3-2. He then pulls back and throws a 110mph fastball high and inside. Rodriguez stood no chance. Strikeout.
The Nationals don't manage to score in the bottom frame, so Strasburg is sent back out for 10th... and the 11th... and the 12th. Strasburg matches Kuroda pitch for pitch as the game remains scoreless and in Strasburg's case, hitless deep into the night. It is now the top of the 20th inning. Game still 9-9. Strasburg has thrown 160 pitches so far and is facing A-Rod again. He loses his grip again, yelling in pain as the fastball ends up shattering A-Rod in the head, leaving him motionless as Strasburg grabbed his elbow. Strasburg picks himself up again, proceeds to get the next two outs, but thanks to a Bryce Harper error where he completely loses the ball in the lights and overthrows the play at the plate, the Yankees manage to score and the game is now 10-9 heading into the bottom of the 20th.
The first two Nationals are put down quickly, and it's all up to Roger Bernadina. He works a 14 pitch at bat against Kuroda, and on the 15th pitch, he hits a slow roller to shortstop and beats out a Jeter throw at first. Then Strasburg steps up to the plate to a standing ovation, the game in his hands. Kuroda quickly gets two strikes across, putting Strasburg into hole. He steps out of the batter box, looks at the night sky, and thinks about what his grandma told him, "always believe in yourself, Stephen". A single tear streaked across his face. He steps back into the box, digs in, and watches Kuroda float a curve over the plate. He swings. Ballgame. Stephen Strasburg has just won the World Series with a two run walkoff home run. Strasburg in complete jubilation skips and jumps over to first where he slips on the bag, breaking his right ankle. His teammates, rushing out of the dugout notice this and offer to help him out until the first base umpire reminds them that they cannot interfere. Strasburg is able to regain control of his feet as he limps over to second. Using his left foot, he steps on second but during the turn, twists his leg, completely tearing the ACL and MCL of his left knee. He is now on the ground, crying in agony, and a hush has now fallen over the entirety of Nationals Park. He again attempts to come to his feet but as he does, he falls over to his right, which ends up completely shattering and breaking his right arm in 36 different places. Strasburg, using every single ounce of will inside him, crawls to third base, the bones in right arm breaking every single time he moves it forward. As he touches third, the crowd then begins to chant "STRAS-BURG STRAS-BURG", giving him the power to crawl over the third base line. Even the Yankees are moved to tears, and join in on the chant. As he inches closer and closer to home, the chants get louder. STRAS-BURG STRAS-BURG. He begins to cry. Right before he touches home, he looks up and sees the thousands of supporters decked in red, showering him with a chorus of cheers which gave him the willpower to go on. He looks towards the luxury boxes and slowly picks up his right arm which is now broken in 297 different places. Using every bit on strength inside him, he manages to lift it up and direct a middle finger towards the box which contains Nationals GM, Mike Rizzo. His right hand slams on home, winning the Nationals the game and the World Series, and Stephen Strasburg immediately passes out and dies. His teammates cheer above him, slowly realizing that he was dead. Their cheers turn into sobs, realizing that the he had just passed in front of their very own eyes. Tyler Clippard hunches over, puts his face right next to Strasburg's cold cheek, crying "w-we did it man... you did it... you are c-champion, Stephen". Clippard weeps over his dead body. The crying is interrupted by a clap. Then another clap. It was the ghost of Walter Johnson, applauding the legendary effort of the late Stephen Strasburg. The team then starts to applaud, then the fans, and if you panned over to the luxury box, you would see Mike Rizzo clapping, tears on his face. The team then lifts up the corpse of Stephen Strasburg to a roar of applause from the Washington faithful, as they carry his dead body on their shoulders, and head into the clubhouse. They don't stop there, however. They walk out into the stadium with his body, the fans inside the stadium following them, forming a mob that chanted STRAS-BURG STRAS-BURG with every step. The mob marches down to the Anacostia River, where Michael Morse takes Strasburg's body from his shoulder, and gently places him into the water. As his dead body sails away, the mob chants louder and louder STRAS-BURG STRAS-BURG as the camera pans towards the night sky where fireworks from National Park are shot off. The screen dims.
Shortly after, on the screen appears the National Mall with the Washington Monument in the background. It is a cold early February morning. The camera pans to a man on a podium with a banner above him and a massive crowd right beneath him. The man is none other than newly elected president Mitt Romney presenting a newly created monument of Stephen Strasburg as the new centerpiece of the mall. As tears run down his cheek, he manages to proclaim "for a man who has given us so much... too much... we dedicate this 47 foot solid gold statue to Stephen Strasburg, the greatest pitcher who ever lived." Screen cuts to black. Credits roll.
He strikes out Jeter and Granderson, both on three pitches, all fastballs and up steps up Alex Rodriguez with 2 outs and the bases loaded. A-Rod had been absolutely killing the ball the entire series, and already had 4 RBIs in the game. Strasburg spits, and stares him down. The first two pitches are high inside fastballs, both of which nearly hit A-Rod. He goes back in the zone making him whiff on two straight heaters. He attempts to break off a curve for the strikeout but releases the ball awkwardly sending it into the stands as he yells in pain. He falls over the mound, shrieking, writhing in pain as the trainers jump out of the dugout to attend to him. "STOP", he yells, sending the entire stadium into a hush. He gathers himself, and stands up as the crowd stands and cheers with him. He dusts himself off, sets, and stares right back at A-Rod, looking to strike him out on 3-2. He then pulls back and throws a 110mph fastball high and inside. Rodriguez stood no chance. Strikeout.
The Nationals don't manage to score in the bottom frame, so Strasburg is sent back out for 10th... and the 11th... and the 12th. Strasburg matches Kuroda pitch for pitch as the game remains scoreless and in Strasburg's case, hitless deep into the night. It is now the top of the 20th inning. Game still 9-9. Strasburg has thrown 160 pitches so far and is facing A-Rod again. He loses his grip again, yelling in pain as the fastball ends up shattering A-Rod in the head, leaving him motionless as Strasburg grabbed his elbow. Strasburg picks himself up again, proceeds to get the next two outs, but thanks to a Bryce Harper error where he completely loses the ball in the lights and overthrows the play at the plate, the Yankees manage to score and the game is now 10-9 heading into the bottom of the 20th.
The first two Nationals are put down quickly, and it's all up to Roger Bernadina. He works a 14 pitch at bat against Kuroda, and on the 15th pitch, he hits a slow roller to shortstop and beats out a Jeter throw at first. Then Strasburg steps up to the plate to a standing ovation, the game in his hands. Kuroda quickly gets two strikes across, putting Strasburg into hole. He steps out of the batter box, looks at the night sky, and thinks about what his grandma told him, "always believe in yourself, Stephen". A single tear streaked across his face. He steps back into the box, digs in, and watches Kuroda float a curve over the plate. He swings. Ballgame. Stephen Strasburg has just won the World Series with a two run walkoff home run. Strasburg in complete jubilation skips and jumps over to first where he slips on the bag, breaking his right ankle. His teammates, rushing out of the dugout notice this and offer to help him out until the first base umpire reminds them that they cannot interfere. Strasburg is able to regain control of his feet as he limps over to second. Using his left foot, he steps on second but during the turn, twists his leg, completely tearing the ACL and MCL of his left knee. He is now on the ground, crying in agony, and a hush has now fallen over the entirety of Nationals Park. He again attempts to come to his feet but as he does, he falls over to his right, which ends up completely shattering and breaking his right arm in 36 different places. Strasburg, using every single ounce of will inside him, crawls to third base, the bones in right arm breaking every single time he moves it forward. As he touches third, the crowd then begins to chant "STRAS-BURG STRAS-BURG", giving him the power to crawl over the third base line. Even the Yankees are moved to tears, and join in on the chant. As he inches closer and closer to home, the chants get louder. STRAS-BURG STRAS-BURG. He begins to cry. Right before he touches home, he looks up and sees the thousands of supporters decked in red, showering him with a chorus of cheers which gave him the willpower to go on. He looks towards the luxury boxes and slowly picks up his right arm which is now broken in 297 different places. Using every bit on strength inside him, he manages to lift it up and direct a middle finger towards the box which contains Nationals GM, Mike Rizzo. His right hand slams on home, winning the Nationals the game and the World Series, and Stephen Strasburg immediately passes out and dies. His teammates cheer above him, slowly realizing that he was dead. Their cheers turn into sobs, realizing that the he had just passed in front of their very own eyes. Tyler Clippard hunches over, puts his face right next to Strasburg's cold cheek, crying "w-we did it man... you did it... you are c-champion, Stephen". Clippard weeps over his dead body. The crying is interrupted by a clap. Then another clap. It was the ghost of Walter Johnson, applauding the legendary effort of the late Stephen Strasburg. The team then starts to applaud, then the fans, and if you panned over to the luxury box, you would see Mike Rizzo clapping, tears on his face. The team then lifts up the corpse of Stephen Strasburg to a roar of applause from the Washington faithful, as they carry his dead body on their shoulders, and head into the clubhouse. They don't stop there, however. They walk out into the stadium with his body, the fans inside the stadium following them, forming a mob that chanted STRAS-BURG STRAS-BURG with every step. The mob marches down to the Anacostia River, where Michael Morse takes Strasburg's body from his shoulder, and gently places him into the water. As his dead body sails away, the mob chants louder and louder STRAS-BURG STRAS-BURG as the camera pans towards the night sky where fireworks from National Park are shot off. The screen dims.
Shortly after, on the screen appears the National Mall with the Washington Monument in the background. It is a cold early February morning. The camera pans to a man on a podium with a banner above him and a massive crowd right beneath him. The man is none other than newly elected president Mitt Romney presenting a newly created monument of Stephen Strasburg as the new centerpiece of the mall. As tears run down his cheek, he manages to proclaim "for a man who has given us so much... too much... we dedicate this 47 foot solid gold statue to Stephen Strasburg, the greatest pitcher who ever lived." Screen cuts to black. Credits roll.
Sawyerson
I'll saw yer son.
- Feb 25, 2007
- 53,408
- 15,861
Oh so hey, it happened.
http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/8...phen-strasburg-immediately-davey-johnson-says
http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/8...phen-strasburg-immediately-davey-johnson-says
Last edited:
ThunderFist17
No Longer a Noob
Man they're dumb
ISAAC_IS_THE_BEST
Super Star
- Nov 14, 2003
- 100,230
- 14,050
I hope they never make the playoffs again.
AUSTIN316ISALEGEND
Star
At least for the rest of Strasburg's career.
This would indeed be horribly hilarious.
![[face_rose]](https://cdn.statically.io/img/www.ignboards.com/styles/ign/ign/smilies/classic/rose.gif "Rose [face_rose]")
nationalsYes.
dodger561
No Longer a Noob
- Oct 15, 2001
- 9,620
- 1,698
![[face_mischief]](https://cdn.statically.io/img/www.ignboards.com/styles/ign/ign/smilies/classic/mischief.gif "Mischief [face_mischief]")
Even if Strasburg ends up having a healthy career and the Nats win a title down the road....this is still the wrong decision. I feel like the Nats are just doing it now to prove a point and they are being stubborn.
Prior had good mechanics....
Prior had good mechanics....
Last edited:
Prior did the Inverted W during his pitching motion.
Going to laugh so hard when they lose the playoffs and realize this was their best chance. Nats keeping him healthy for future trade bait.
- Feb 9, 2011
- 17,091
- 19,661
The 'Inverted W' wasn't regarded as a death wish until after Prior's career flamed out and scouts/analysts scrambled to find a reason behind it. When Prior was coming out of college, many were describing his mechanics as somewhere between 'ideal' and 'perfect.'
And it's also worth noting that the whole 'Inverted W' issue is a bit overstated. Countless pitchers fit into that description, and plenty had long, productive careers without arm issues. Hell, Randy Johnson, Greg Maddux, Tom Glavine, Pedro Martinez, and Nolan Ryan had varying degrees of it in their mechanics, as did John Smoltz (who stayed healthy into his 30s). Johan Santana has been a mess lately, but blaming it on the 'Inverted W' is convenient for a pitcher that had some 2000 professional IP before having arm issues. As for current pitchers, C.J. Wilson and Cliff have been healthy into their 30s with fairly pronounced 'Inverted W' mechanics. You'll even see some slap that label on Felix Hernandez, and he's been very durable throughout his career.
Last edited:
The Inverted W is the baby of pseudo-scientists like Chris O'Leary. He posts on another blog I post on and he consistently refuses to provide any kind of evidence for his claims -- studies that show people with particular mechanical "issues" get hurt more often, anything like that. The reason for that is that there are none, and it's all barely any more legitimate than fortune telling. These people make a living predicting arm injuries, then pointing out how they predicted it when it happens, even if its years and years later.
Whatever it is that causes peoples' arms to break down (beyond the motion of throwing a baseball in general) is not something that's well understood, and it's definitely not as simple as the Inverted W.
Whatever it is that causes peoples' arms to break down (beyond the motion of throwing a baseball in general) is not something that's well understood, and it's definitely not as simple as the Inverted W.
Last edited:
Random question:
Why is it called an inverted W? Was calling it a M just too boring?
Why is it called an inverted W? Was calling it a M just too boring?
I'm guessing it's cause it's not really an M. M has those outside lines straight while W has them at an angle, as a pitcher would.
This post is the single greatest thing I've ever read
