Plot Holes GALORE in inFamous 2

[Fyles20]

So I've beaten the game on both good and bad, and I have to say, the plot has so many holes in it it's become confusing to make any sense of some key story elements. First lets start with Kessler, as those who've played the first game know, Kessler is Cole from the future come back in time to give Cole powers in order to defeat the beast. According to the first game, the Beast appeared in Kessler's timeline and started destroying humanity. Kessler had the choice to rise up and fight the Beast or flee and he chose to flee, but the beast eventually catches up to him and kills his family. This causes him to use his powers to go back in time to prepare his earlier self (Cole) to fight the beast. That sets up for infamous 2 which has some glaring plot holes mainly:

1) If John is the Beast, then who the hell is the Beast in Kessler's timeline? John became the Beast because of the Ray Sphere in Coles timeline, yet in Kessler's there is no allusion to John being turned in to the Beast at all. How can there be two different Beasts? And if John is the beast in both, then how did he become it? Although the first game hints that a Ray Sphere is developed in Kessler's time, there is no reference in either game to it being the cause/creation of the Beast in that time. Assuming it is and also assuming John becomes the beast from it, that still doesn't answer how or why John became it since in Cole's time John became only because Kessler himself created the Ray Sphere in Cole's timeline.

2) Assuming John is somehow the Beast in both timelines, perhaps the biggest hole of i2 is that Kessler seems to know John will become the Beast, yet does nothing (like killing John when he's infiltrated the First Sons) to stop that from happening, completely undermining the motivation's behind Kessler's character in the first game. The 5th Dead Drop, titled "Bad Omen" really brings this plot hole to light. In it, Kessler seems to know John will become the Beast saying he has an "important destiny". And here's where things make no sense: Kessler goes back in time to have Cole activate the Ray Sphere early on in order to fight the Beast. Kessler spends decades developing the Ray Sphere, the tool which will allow Cole to fight the Beast, yet it's the very same Ray Sphere that creates the Beast in Cole's timeline, and, as mentioned above Kessler knows John will become the Beast! What kind of bullcrap is that? Kessler knows John will become the Beast so his character motivations make little sense when all he'd really have to do is go back in time, kill John, and then boom, problem solved. No need to give Cole powers because there wouldn't be a beast, no plague, no need to kill Trish, etc. Cole can lead a happy life, and the world would be fine. And if the Ray Sphere somehow still gets created in Cole's timeline all Kessler would have to do is use his powers to prevent it from being used and/or destroy those who know how to create it. Simple solution. But instead, Kessler decides to create a tool which gives Cole powers to combat the Beast while simultaneously creating the Beast itself. Talk about very convoluted, and very unnecessary. Real dumb.

3) These may or may not be plot holes, I haven't read much in to the mythos of the inFamous world aside from playing through both games several times but I haven't been able to decipher these. First, how does Kessler himself get powers? The games never makes mention to Kessler activating the Ray Sphere in his timeline, so how does he get powers? Like I said above, the first game offers vague hints in a few lines of dialogue that the Ray Sphere did indeed exist in Kessler's timeline, although who the creator of it is and also whether or not Kessler himself uses it is unknown. What's more, since Kessler is a future version of Cole, it would be logical to assume their power are very similiar if not the same, yet how come Kessler has the power to go back in time, yet Cole doesn't? Shouldn't Cole have time traveling powers too?

Overall I loved both games a lot and had a great time playing them. The first inFamous stands as one of my favorite games on ps3. The second is great as well, the gameplay in particular being really refined and smoother. I just can't stand some of the glaring plot holes in it though. The plot doesn't do a good job building off of the story of the first game especially the epicness that is its ending. inFamous 2 was fun to play, but the plot just doesn't hold up. Everyone let me know what you think and please if anyone can potentially fill in these holes let me know! I've been racking my brain these past several days trying to make sense of them, especially the second hole i mentioned above although I'm almost positive some of these can't be answered unless there's a third game, which, given the endings of i2, seems like it would be quite the tall order to fill them in. Please discuss and thanks for any thoughtful contributions!

 

[solosith]

This in in reply to #3.

In Kessler's timeline, he developed his powers naturally over time. Because of this his were stronger since he trained with them as they appeared. Cole's powers were given to him early so they were not as developed as much as Kessler's were at the time. In regards to the time travel, in the first game it said that it was the last power to develop for Kessler.

 

[Tiger61378]

This in in reply to #3.

In Kessler's timeline, he developed his powers naturally over time. Because of this his were stronger since he trained with them as they appeared. Cole's powers were given to him early so they were not as developed as much as Kessler's were at the time. In regards to the time travel, in the first game it said that it was the last power to develop for Kessler.

Exactly right. And along with this particular line, it also clears up why Kessler didn't know that John was the Beast...the Beast appeared naturally in Kessler's timeline, and nobody really knew who it was. I'm not even sure that the Ray Sphere existed in Kessler's timeline (its vague whether or not it did)...I think that it was something that he created specifically to give Cole a head start on being able to defeat the Beast when he appears...only triggering the Ray Sphere also inadvertantly sped up the Beast's appearance as well.

Really though...you have to sort of feel for John. The poor guy didn't really realize that he was a Conduit, didn't know what all the experiments they were putting him through were for, and then ended up being atomized. No wonder he went insane when his powers manifested after he was blown up!

Seems like Kessler's Beast and Cole's Beast have different purposes as well...the one in Kessler's timeline existed ONLY to destroy everything in sight...he didn't care about casualties, he just wanted to watch the world burn. The Beast in Cole's timeline, however, seems to be trying to stop the spread of the Ray Sphere plague, and is only seemingly destroying areas where it had spread to.

 

[Brandonmac10]

Easy explanation... John is not the beast. The beast is coming soon. Thats my guess for the story of inFAMOUS 3

In inFAMOUS 2 the beast wasn't just destroying the cities when traveling along the coast he was making ray sphere blasts using his powers. Remember how he wanted to activate conduits so that they wouldn't die of the plauge, well yeah thats probably what he was doing and it destroyed the other cities along the coast.

Kessler probably didn't know John was the beast his human and beast forms are very different.

Cole didn't develop time travel powers yet and he would have developed more powers given enough time. Remember The first game only took place within 21 days after the blast and the second game starts only a month after the end of the first. Cole didn't have much time with his powers.

The Kessler's Beast thing I have no idea what his motives were. Maybe John didn't calm down when he pulled himself back together and he just kept on destroying the world.

 

[Fyles20]

What's even more annoying is that Sucker Punch didn't do a good job at all of portraying the Beast in the second game like they did in the first. In the first game they made the Beast out to be this ruthless, coldblooded killing machine which hungered to destroy the world and had no care for human life. They didn't translate that well in to the second one. In inFamous 2 the Beast doesn't seem that bad at all. He's actually trying to save the world in his own twisted, radical way. In fact the game almost tries to get you to sympathize with John for all his hardship and having to "pull himself back together atom by atom". That's such crap. It's goes completely against how they portrayed the Beast in the first game and definitely doesn't make him look like a monster. I'm capable of letting some of the character inconsistencies go between both games but the Beast one was just too much. Sucker punch definitely could've done a better job on the beast in the second game. Oh well.

 

[Purple_Nova]

My take on the Infamous story. If you see any holes in my story, please tell me.

Kesslers Story: The First Sons were trying to cause havoc as usual, so they decided to give the ray sphere to some random bike courier, someone insignificant, Kessler/Cole. Kessler got his powers, If you caught this in the story, the PLAUGE was caused by the ray sphere explosion. Kessler wasn't running away from the beast, he was running from the plauge, because his family didn't have the conduit gene, or at least Trish didn't. In Kesslers timeline there was no way to stop the plauge, so he went back in time. From their, he basiclly manipulated all the things that would happen to Cole, Wolfe, and John. He thought of the story of the Beast and thought of a way to make it so. He took a conduit, he chose John. He eventually indirectly or directly gave the ray sphere to the old conduit/second Boss in Infamous 1, knowing Cole would get it. He showed intrest in Cole so John would investigate him. He sabotaged the Ray Sphere so it would blow if Cole tried to destroy it, knowing John would encourage it. Kessler then eventually showed Cole the FAKE BEAST so that he would be scared and find more reason to detonate the Anti-Ray Sphere, knowing it would destroy the plauge, and the Beast.

By the way, it says in Infamous 1 that Kessler just sped up the ray sphere creation, he didn't completely create it.

 

[maullster]

We know for sure the Ray Sphere was going to be created either way. The First Sons were developing it in Kessler's timeline, before he traveled back. Remember that Kessler "accelerated" the development. And since Cole/Kessler already had the Conduit gene, he could have developed his powers naturally over time. This also explains how Kessler had different powers than Cole, including time travel.

Remember, the Ray Sphere is specifically designed to concentrate electricity into the user. With present Cole, it worked. With everybody else, it didn't work. Its radiation activated their Conduit genes, resulting in different powers. Although Bertrand activated it the same way Cole did, remember that it was a prototype. Cole activated the final version.

What I said about how Kessler gained powers helps explain how John became the Beast in Kessler's timeline. John already had the Conduit gene, so like Kessler, he developed his powers over time. John, unknowingly, eventually became the Beast in Kessler's timeline. Also, in that timeline Kessler never met John.

I don't think Kessler knew John was the Beast. Think about when John reveals himself to be the Beast in the second game. Cole didn't know John was the Beast until he revealed it. And by that time Cole had a good look at both the Beast and John. So if Cole wasn't smart enough to figure it out then, Kessler wasn't smart enough to figure it out either.

The "destiny" he referred to doesn't have to mean John's Beastliness. Kessler planned nearly everything that happened in the first game. So his "destiny" for John could have been for him to help Cole get to the Ray Sphere near the end of the game. After John dies in the first game, Kessler says he's either proud or disappointed in Cole (depending on what you choose to do with the Ray Sphere.) This proves that Kessler knew it was going to happen.

And as for John's reassembly, I have another theory. Basically, everyone with the Conduit gene is immune to radiation. With regular humans, the radiation gives them the Plague. When the Ray Sphere self-destructed near the end of the first game, it didn't kill John. Because of his Conduit gene, he magically had the ability to reassemble his atoms. No it doesn't make sense, but neither does the ability to make a device that gives somebody electric superpowers.

I was unsure about a lot of things too. I don't like how I had to think this out to get the answers. I did have to do so for Inception, but the movie was meant to be a mindf*ck. Anyways, I still don't understand one thing. How was the Beast triggering the dormant Conduit genes? John's whole reason for doing all of that was to turn people into Conduits, thus keeping them safe from the Plague.

 

[Sandru]

Pretty sure John was the Beast, he was in a way fitting to the image of the Beast. They just couldnt have some no name person, killing everyone for no reason. It would make even less sense if you actually think about it.

My money is on Alden being the InFamous 3 bad guy. He had psychic powers naturally without the ray sphere. Probably the only person not effected by the RFI. That scene on the bridge was total sequel bate. I though he would be in InFamous 2 or at least 3.

 

[Fyles20]

I just wish Sucker Punch would do a better job explaining some of these story elements. I think its pretty ridiculous that we're left to speculate about so, so many aspects of the story. That just doesn't sit right with me. Like I understand that there's the potential for a lot of these loose threads to be cleared up if they decide to do a third game, but given the pretty closed endings of both the good and evil playthroughs of i2, I find it hard for them to do so in any well-thought out and meaningful way. I wish they would offer more insight in to why certain aspects of the story turned out the way they did, that way we wouldn't be left guessing or wondering what in the hell's going on. The first inFamous has a fantastic story but at the same time it left open the possibility of a sequel to answer some of the open-ended questions. I2 didn't answer any of those questions though, the pacing of the story was off, the plot and characters were both inconsistent and didn't build off of the groundwork laid in the first game, and so many questions are STILL left open ended even though both endings for the game make it hard to pull off a third game without introducing some sort of deus ex machina plot device or something in order to bring Cole back from the dead in the case of the good ending. I liked the game, but after taking my (metaphorical) rose tinted glasses off, I realized that the story in i2 doesn't hold up well at all in terms of character motivations and remaining consistent with the plot of the first game. It's so frustrating to see that Sucker Punch had the opportunity to clear the air on some of the mystery surrounding the series yet chose not to or in some cases didn't offer a satisfactory answer. If there is an inFamous 3 I really hope Sucker Punch provides some strong, meaningful insight in to why certain events played out the way they did in the series.

 

[w0nderboy3]

What's even more annoying is that Sucker Punch didn't do a good job at all of portraying the Beast in the second game like they did in the first. In the first game they made the Beast out to be this ruthless, coldblooded killing machine which hungered to destroy the world and had no care for human life. They didn't translate that well in to the second one. In inFamous 2 the Beast doesn't seem that bad at all. He's actually trying to save the world in his own twisted, radical way. In fact the game almost tries to get you to sympathize with John for all his hardship and having to "pull himself back together atom by atom". That's such crap. It's goes completely against how they portrayed the Beast in the first game and definitely doesn't make him look like a monster. I'm capable of letting some of the character inconsistencies go between both games but the Beast one was just too much. Sucker punch definitely could've done a better job on the beast in the second game. Oh well.

The beast vision was from Kessler's point of view, for all we know the beast had the same goal, but form someone sitting there watching him, he just looks like some giant thing destroying cities...and it's not like anyone would ask it why it's doing that. At least it had a goal now instead of just killing things, I get tired of seeing things just destroying cities for no real reason other than to display how "EVIL!!!!" it really is....it's lazy, just about as lazy as the whole going back in time and being the indirect cause of what ever it was that destroyed your future. Thing that bugs me the most though is Kessler knew what John would become and made Cole go through ALL that so he would learn how to do what needed to be done in order to stop the beast. What needed to be done was the ray sphere needed to be destroyed, and Trish not be killed...and then Cole's life would have been perfect, and by extension Kessler's

 

[IPunchMidgets]

How could there be a third game? I just finished my first playthrough earlier and did the Good path and Cole dies, along with every other Conduit and would be Conduit.

 

[Death_The_Kid]

we dont know if cole is actually dead, because at the end of the good ending lighting strikes coles boat which we all know cole gets a health regen when sucking in lightning

 

[kyle0914]

::Spoilers::

i also don't see how there is going to be a third game based on the story lines. at the end of the first infamous no matter what path you picked the story ended in the same place mostly. in infamous 2 the story paths go to two very different places. in one every human is dead and the conduits have taken over the earth, in the other its the reverse and all the conduits are dead "allegedly". If they only make two games good on them, there are too many developers out there who crank out sequel after sequel ::COUGH:: HALO 4 ::COUGH::


But in the end yeah there are some issues with the plot, but the good gameplay is enough to over look such issues.

 

[sng-ign]

If SuckerPunch only make two games good on them, there are too many developers out there who crank out sequel after sequel ::COUGH:: HALO 4 ::COUGH::

inb4COD

I personally wouldn't mind seeing what's in store for Infamous 3 or Halo 4.

I just don't want Infamous to turn into something like Assassins Creed .... or, with the announcement of Revelations for 2012, Assassin's Greed.

 

[maullster]

I'm actually pretty interested in what happens with Moya and the FBI. Remember John was thinking that the NSA has been compromised and there was some conspiracy going on.

 

[sng-ign]

Moya was supposedly KIA in the Infamous comics tie-in (I heard this second-hand).

 

[xXGrungeRocker95Xx]

This in in reply to #3.

In Kessler's timeline, he developed his powers naturally over time. Because of this his were stronger since he trained with them as they appeared. Cole's powers were given to him early so they were not as developed as much as Kessler's were at the time. In regards to the time travel, in the first game it said that it was the last power to develop for Kessler.

Exactly right. And along with this particular line, it also clears up why Kessler didn't know that John was the Beast...the Beast appeared naturally in Kessler's timeline, and nobody really knew who it was. I'm not even sure that the Ray Sphere existed in Kessler's timeline (its vague whether or not it did)...I think that it was something that he created specifically to give Cole a head start on being able to defeat the Beast when he appears...only triggering the Ray Sphere also inadvertantly sped up the Beast's appearance as well.

Really though...you have to sort of feel for John. The poor guy didn't really realize that he was a Conduit, didn't know what all the experiments they were putting him through were for, and then ended up being atomized. No wonder he went insane when his powers manifested after he was blown up!

Seems like Kessler's Beast and Cole's Beast have different purposes as well...the one in Kessler's timeline existed ONLY to destroy everything in sight...he didn't care about casualties, he just wanted to watch the world burn. The Beast in Cole's timeline, however, seems to be trying to stop the spread of the Ray Sphere plague, and is only seemingly destroying areas where it had spread to.

i think alden was the beast in Kesslers storyline, they never said if he died or not, just that he fell off that bridge. Cole said "...Nobody could have survived the fall, of course Alden was a conduit." (i think thats what he said)

 

[ArtakhaPrime]

Simple;

A conduit is a person who has the POTENTIAL to evolve superpowers.

The Ray Sphere is a device that EVOLVES superpowers into conduits.

he Ray Sphere is NOT necessary for evolving superpowers, it simply just speeds things up.

Kessler (future Cole, whatev), evolved superpowers naturally, and by time upgraded them.

The Beast (John, in BOTH universes) also eventually evolved superpowers, and became The Beast.

In the in-game universe, the Ray Sphere is created, so it can speed up Cole's power process, so he has more time to fight The Beast.

Unfortunately, John gets his hands in the Sphere, and uses it on himself, speeding up his process as well.

But... Where's Alden? Who the hell IS Moya, and IS there going to be a InFamous 3?

 

[BurntToast01]

Yes, inFamous 2 did not make any sense at all. A point no one else noticed, Kessler was the leader of the First Sons and he sped up the invention of the Ray Sphere in order to combat the beast. Now, killing John would not prevent the beast from becoming, because they would have just put another Conduit agent to investigate the The Three Sons and the same thing would have happened over again. The Beast was created when the Ray Sphere exploded and transferred all its energy into John, creating a Conduit like no other. But, if Kessler was the leader of The Three Suns, he could have just stopped the invention of the Ray Sphere, and the whole event could have been avoided, so the 2nd game not only had a horrible plot, it made nonsense of the First Plot. I think a third Infamous could be created, but it would have too be nonrelated to the other inFamouses. Like a whole seperate book. I thought the first game was much better than the 2nd. The 2nd was graphically given the tools to make it good, but because of a bad plot, bad scenery, and bad "comic book" animations, it was no where near as good.

 

[Modest-Genius]

1) If John is the Beast, then who the hell is the Beast in Kessler's timeline? John became the Beast because of the Ray Sphere in Coles timeline, yet in Kessler's there is no allusion to John being turned in to the Beast at all. How can there be two different Beasts? And if John is the beast in both, then how did he become it? Although the first game hints that a Ray Sphere is developed in Kessler's time, there is no reference in either game to it being the cause/creation of the Beast in that time. Assuming it is and also assuming John becomes the beast from it, that still doesn't answer how or why John became it since in Cole's time John became only because Kessler himself created the Ray Sphere in Cole's timeline.

I have my own theory about this. Both Evil and Good Cole exist, both stories are canon - they are happening in different dimensions. At the end of Evil Infamous 2 Cole becomes the beast - eventually this power will consume him and he will destroy everything - travelling from dimension to dimension destroying all - until he gets to Kesslers dimension which sets off the train of events which creates him in inFamous 1 and will probably destroy him in inFamous 3 (by the hand of good cole)

2) Assuming John is somehow the Beast in both timelines, perhaps the biggest hole of i2 is that Kessler seems to know John will become the Beast, yet does nothing (like killing John when he's infiltrated the First Sons) to stop that from happening, completely undermining the motivation's behind Kessler's character in the first game. The 5th Dead Drop, titled "Bad Omen" really brings this plot hole to light. In it, Kessler seems to know John will become the Beast saying he has an "important destiny". And here's where things make no sense: Kessler goes back in time to have Cole activate the Ray Sphere early on in order to fight the Beast. Kessler spends decades developing the Ray Sphere, the tool which will allow Cole to fight the Beast, yet it's the very same Ray Sphere that creates the Beast in Cole's timeline, and, as mentioned above Kessler knows John will become the Beast! What kind of bullcrap is that? Kessler knows John will become the Beast so his character motivations make little sense when all he'd really have to do is go back in time, kill John, and then boom, problem solved. No need to give Cole powers because there wouldn't be a beast, no plague, no need to kill Trish, etc. Cole can lead a happy life, and the world would be fine. And if the Ray Sphere somehow still gets created in Cole's timeline all Kessler would have to do is use his powers to prevent it from being used and/or destroy those who know how to create it. Simple solution. But instead, Kessler decides to create a tool which gives Cole powers to combat the Beast while simultaneously creating the Beast itself. Talk about very convoluted, and very unnecessary. Real dumb.

Lets say my theory is correct - John is not the Beast in Kessler's time. Possibly all Kessler meant when he said that John would have an important destiny would be meeting Cole and setting him on the way to being a hero to stop the real Beast. As for the Ray Sphere creating the beast (evil cole, imo) that would be cruel irony as it both creates and destroys him.

3) These may or may not be plot holes, I haven't read much in to the mythos of the inFamous world aside from playing through both games several times but I haven't been able to decipher these. First, how does Kessler himself get powers? The games never makes mention to Kessler activating the Ray Sphere in his timeline, so how does he get powers? Like I said above, the first game offers vague hints in a few lines of dialogue that the Ray Sphere did indeed exist in Kessler's timeline, although who the creator of it is and also whether or not Kessler himself uses it is unknown. What's more, since Kessler is a future version of Cole, it would be logical to assume their power are very similiar if not the same, yet how come Kessler has the power to go back in time, yet Cole doesn't? Shouldn't Cole have time traveling powers too?

If you look closely in the scene in inFamous 1 where Cole's monologue tells us Kessler took "a one way trip back in time" you can see he is holding a blast core - Cole simply hasn't come across a time-travelling blast core.

How Kessler himself got powers is very much open to interpretations. My theory is that a sphere is developed in Kesslers dimension, probably by the First Sons, they activate it as they believed in giving people powers, but it works fine and a select amount of people slowly develop powers with no explosion consequence.

This is why The beast (evil cole) destroyed every dimension until he got to the one with Kessler - who used his time travel power to jump back in time (still in his same dimension) and then create the ray sphere earlier than he would have. This changes the timelime and creates at least two separate dimensions - one where the powers turn cole into a hero and one where they eventually turn him into the beast.

Remember John "Apparent Beast" was early in inFamous 2. That's because while he had the powers of "the beast" he wasn't actually "the beast." This is supported by how he doesn't want to destroy the world but in fact save it in what he thinks is the best way possible.

Infamous 3 could possibly be about an older good Cole (revived at the end of inFamous 2) living his life - and right on schedule Evil Cole (Beast) enters his dimension for the final showdown.

 

[omnivus]

I'm just wondering about the last dead drop. The audio ends with sounds of a struggle and the microphone getting shut off.

So how did the file get attached to that bird that was flying around?

 

[Bcraggen]

Listen guys, both Alden and Sasha are dead. They died in the comics between InFamous 1 and 2. Alden got dissected alive by Moya's crew and Sasha sacrificed herself to get Cole out of a Helicopter that crashed into the harbor and killed Sasha and Moya. So they are all dead. the only people left alive from InFamous 1 are Cole, Zeke, and John.

 

[sng-ign]

Listen guys, both Alden and Sasha are dead. They died in the comics between InFamous 1 and 2. Alden got dissected alive by Moya's crew and Sasha sacrificed herself to get Cole out of a Helicopter that crashed into the harbor and killed Sasha and Moya. So they are all dead. the only people left alive from InFamous 1 are Cole, Zeke, and John.

I hated how there was no summary in Infamous 2 about the comic stories.

 

[Jamie95]

Who cares, it's a fun game just focus on playing it rather then being a critic of it

 

[gananim]

So after seeing the video today posted by PlayStation () I went around the web looking at various infamous nonsense out of excitement and boredom. And then i stumbled upon this thread some how, and id like to set things straight.

In keslers time line, he develops his powers naturally, as does john aka the beast. As the beast begins it quest to awaken all conduits, (yes seeing as this was johns quest in i2 it is easy to assume that this was the same or kesslers beast, SP just kept it quiet for use in i2), havoc is reeked, and knowing that the beast kills humans and saves conduits, kills kesslers family. Out of grief for his loss, kessler uses his newly developed power, time travel- which is one one way- to travel back to possibly stop this from happening. Through time he is hardened and forces his way into the first-sons, an organisation dedicate to advancing and developing conduits ability. Knowing of the ray sphere- which works by taking all the bio electricity of people in the radius and forcing it into any conduits immediately awakening/accelerating the natural powers within- from his time, he focused on its production in hopes that he could use it to accelerate the rate at which Cole develops his powers so he could be ready for the beast in time, unlike himself.

Once finished, kessler promptly requests its delivery by Cole. Once Cole receives the package for what he thinks is a normal delivery, it is detonated, awakening his powers, along with awakening/strengthening the conduits in the city as well. kessler watches and controls Cole's development. He bouts with Sasha the souse of the plague in the city, as her power is mind control witch can only be done through the catalyst of the tar, witch its distribution subsequently causes the plague. following that he fights the telekinetic, Alden aka the former air to the throne in the first sons. Who was developing his powers and was empowered by the residual energy provided by the ray sphere. Kessler later kills his love, Trish, in an attempt to harden Cole.

Then john shows up. John works for The NSA, a group i would suspect is similar to "the men in black" in the us. My guess is that the main goal of the NSA is to subdue and control and conduits who develop powers, keeping knowledge of there entire existence from the general public. which would explain why there's no real common knowledge of conduits in the would because they are all either hiding, like nix, or taken away by the NSA. (i must admit, i do not know if kessler knows if john is the beast or not. My theory is if he did, he did not touch him either in fear he would be triggered or because he wanted to allow Cole to be the hero he couldn't be. and if he didn't it was convenient) He is sucked into the wake of the ray spheres destruction. This is where it gets tricky. Kessler had no idea that that would happen. All he knows is when the beast comes in his time line. But since john was effected by the ray sphere his powers were awakened early as well, causing him to show up earlier than kessler warned Cole he would at the end of I1 after fighting him in a last test of Cole's ability's. By the way all of kesslers powers are in fact electricity based, even the time travel.

Now in I2, the beast shows up early, like i stated earlier, because of his accelerated development due to the sphere. Here, in new marais, home of the first sons and ray sphere, Cole trys to gain more power before he confronts the beast. He is aided by nix, a conduits who's power is from a early test blast of a prototype used by Bertrand to gain his powers, Lucy a NSA agent and Conduit. and Wolfe a lead scientist on the ray sphere. He fights Bertrand the first time. Lucy it kidnapped, given powers, and rescued. In the process they unknowingly release the ice guys. Fights the ice guys. Takes either nix or quos powers. they try to nuke the beast. doesn't work. he kills Bertrand. and then john shows up and explains his quest to Cole. at this point it can go two ways. he can help him and kill all humans. or use the RFI and kill all conduits. either way the original Cole is no more. Leaving NO opportunity for a continuation of the Cole story line, effectively killing him off or morphing him into the beast its self.

Now there is a possibility that at the end of the good he is hit with that lightning bolt and he is somehow revived. and at the end of the evil he transforms back into Cole once done with the revival. Leaving a slim opportunity to continue the game. but the drastic difference in the two versions of the world could not work properly. All conduits die, but the one that powered the source and was at the source, somehow remained in pieces and revived as the lone conduit of the world. or all humans die and the world is completely over run by the newly powered conduits. the difference is to vast to create a correlating story. Dont get me wrong, i hope it is a new Infamous game. but the fact is its a good ending and it would not be in good taste to continue from a vast ending as such.

 

[ColeNate2121]

I agree with the whole "dimension jumping" idea. I actually think John was never the Beast and Cole himself always was. Kessler didn't fight him because he didn't want his family to die and was possibly scared of fighting himself. Evil Cle at the end of infamous 2 travelled into Kessler's dimension and killed Kessler's family, not knowing he actually killed trish and his would be daughters. I think Infamous 3 would have to start out with the evil ending, as a "what-if scenario." this would mean that the evil ending would have to be canon, although SP already said that the good ending was canon. Our Cole's story (if played as hero) is over-he stopped HIMSELF (albeit involuntarily) from becoming the Beast and closed the loop, so to speak. Infamous 3 would have Evil Cole skipping dimensions, and either a new character or a different dimension Cole battling him.

 

[MasterCaedus]

The entire idea behind inFamous 1&2 was that Cole was supposed to fight the Beast. The fact that he defeated it might not mean that anything Kessler showed him was true: for instance, the idea that time travel would not rip a hole in the universe. In order to close the destructive loop Cole might travel back in time regardless of what happens, i.e. become the Beast in Kessler's timeline (if it exists) in order to ensure his creation and humanity's survival. Or, if the Kessler timeline was false, good Cole has to go back in time to ensure that the Beast is defeated. Unless Sucker Punch releases its own ideas on time travel, these seem like the most scientifically viable versions of the story.

Then again, it is a game about a guy who can shoot electricity from every pore of his body, so who knows?

 

[sng-ign]

So Infamous is SuckerPunch's version of Looper?

 

[Nathanmaxtro]

I don't see a reason for Cole to go back in time after 2.

With the destruction of the best, the loop was closed. I highly doubt beast Cole would go back in time to stop himself. Good Cole has no reason to go back. Unless he wanted to rescue his girlfriend and then take her back to the future.

 

[Cra-Z]

Well Second Son(The new game) has one major plot hole:7 years later, a 24 year old conduit exists. As do regular humans. What could have happened? I have a few theories.
1. A different,a.k.a second conduit gene came to be. So this guy had it and was immune to the Good Cole conduit blast. 2. Assuming a Bad Cole ending was canon, the Conduits made a cure and some changed themselves to unpowered humans. Then the conduits were considered evil, and most were quickly wiped out.
3. A little kid on that bus had conduit powers, and accidentally gave them to this new guy Deslin. So now he has powers that he didn't even have potential to get.
4. Sucker Punch said "Screw inFAMOUS 1&2!!! We're messing up all inFAMOUS lore, and no one will care because it will be fun!!!"
Number 4? Vey likely

 

[sng-ign]

^ A mix of 2 and 4 probably happened.

7 years is a long time -- maybe Cole-Beast and the plague were fought to a stand-still.

 

[KegSJ]

This is really dumb to be commenting on so late, but second son is going to come out soon. So I'll give my opinion I guess. Spoilers.

First off you need to establish time travel rules for this series.
1. Going back in time, and altering any timeline, even one involving your own existence and how you came to that existence is allowed, and makes your timeline invalid. (implied by time travel being one way, however possibly untrue)
2. If you were to make your timeline invalid your own existence is not ensured to end. (given it doesn't follow the rule that copies are sentenced to swift death, or that Kessler wasn't already weakened by the loss of his timeline, or any other death pacts of this nature)
3. The timeline Kessler comes from has to many variables to be accurately, or directly link to the one the player witnesses.
4. Characters retain their powers and roles regardless of timeline, however some variances occur.
5. These rules are subject to negate, as powers received from ray sphere blasts or (assumed) evolving of such powers are relatively specific to the individual (however duplicates do occur, 3 characters with pyrokenisis, and 2 with electrokenisis, however the 2 were the same person)

Applying these rules to the Player timeline is simple. However first, some points.
Kesslers timeline gives at least 5 years before the beast appears. Kessler is shown to have two kids and (given the timelines mimic) trish's hair is much longer than in the player timeline.
The 5 years could be much longer, however this allows time for the ray sphere to finish development, as it was originally intended for general development of conduit powers. (assumtion)
This means that either the ray sphere could have safely been set off forgoing explosion, or tested with john; creating beast, or powers could have been developed as with The Tates, or Lucy Kuo.
Kessler could not have known for sure who the beast would be. John would have had no reason to become a human and talked to him, and would have killed the opposition had he received it.
The Idea of dimension jumping is the addition of a completely new idea, and would have it's own set of rules. So it is exempt from this explanation. (I personally don't like it.)

Infamous 1
Kessler's timeline is referenced only twice in this game, when first meeting cole and the end of the game, when he shows cole what happens. Anything that is not explained fully in this timeline is complete speculation. Because it is shown to the player that kessler has roughly the same powers, but more developed, it is assumed that John would become the beast if in contact with the fully developed ray sphere, or would develop these powers regardless. Kessler's view on the beast is biased, as it is responsible for the death of is family, assuming the ray sphere is the cause of his powers, the plague would have happened anyway, and his mission in Kessler's timeline would have been the same. If John was killed literally all of these problems would have been solved, and none of this bad would happen, or john would become the beast as he has physical control of everyone of his atoms. Kessler's death was only the result of an interference by Zeke, and it is assumed that without this Cole would have lost the fight.
Infamous 2
John's powers are accelerated by the ray sphere, and so pyrokenisis and the ability to reform himself after being torn apart by the ray sphere is a confirmed power in both timelines. Given his mission was the same in both timelines and the plague is a part of both timelines, a biased account of his motives is also part of the timeline. It is also assumed that the good timeline is canon, and the blast did not kill off all conduits, as in second son humans are clearly a thing. Given all of these assumptions and connections plot holes still exist. Feel free to poke holes. You savages.

Also I bet Delsin gets his powers from John reincarnated. Cause I'm a dreamer.

 

[MasterCaedus]

This is really dumb to be commenting on so late, but second son is going to come out soon. So I'll give my opinion I guess. Spoilers.

First off you need to establish time travel rules for this series.
1. Going back in time, and altering any timeline, even one involving your own existence and how you came to that existence is allowed, and makes your timeline invalid. (implied by time travel being one way, however possibly untrue)
2. If you were to make your timeline invalid your own existence is not ensured to end. (given it doesn't follow the rule that copies are sentenced to swift death, or that Kessler wasn't already weakened by the loss of his timeline, or any other death pacts of this nature)
3. The timeline Kessler comes from has to many variables to be accurately, or directly link to the one the player witnesses.
4. Characters retain their powers and roles regardless of timeline, however some variances occur.
5. These rules are subject to negate, as powers received from ray sphere blasts or (assumed) evolving of such powers are relatively specific to the individual (however duplicates do occur, 3 characters with pyrokenisis, and 2 with electrokenisis, however the 2 were the same person)

Applying these rules to the Player timeline is simple. However first, some points.
Kesslers timeline gives at least 5 years before the beast appears. Kessler is shown to have two kids and (given the timelines mimic) trish's hair is much longer than in the player timeline.
The 5 years could be much longer, however this allows time for the ray sphere to finish development, as it was originally intended for general development of conduit powers. (assumtion)
This means that either the ray sphere could have safely been set off forgoing explosion, or tested with john; creating beast, or powers could have been developed as with The Tates, or Lucy Kuo.
Kessler could not have known for sure who the beast would be. John would have had no reason to become a human and talked to him, and would have killed the opposition had he received it.
The Idea of dimension jumping is the addition of a completely new idea, and would have it's own set of rules. So it is exempt from this explanation. (I personally don't like it.)

Infamous 1
Kessler's timeline is referenced only twice in this game, when first meeting cole and the end of the game, when he shows cole what happens. Anything that is not explained fully in this timeline is complete speculation. Because it is shown to the player that kessler has roughly the same powers, but more developed, it is assumed that John would become the beast if in contact with the fully developed ray sphere, or would develop these powers regardless. Kessler's view on the beast is biased, as it is responsible for the death of is family, assuming the ray sphere is the cause of his powers, the plague would have happened anyway, and his mission in Kessler's timeline would have been the same. If John was killed literally all of these problems would have been solved, and none of this bad would happen, or john would become the beast as he has physical control of everyone of his atoms. Kessler's death was only the result of an interference by Zeke, and it is assumed that without this Cole would have lost the fight.
Infamous 2
John's powers are accelerated by the ray sphere, and so pyrokenisis and the ability to reform himself after being torn apart by the ray sphere is a confirmed power in both timelines. Given his mission was the same in both timelines and the plague is a part of both timelines, a biased account of his motives is also part of the timeline. It is also assumed that the good timeline is canon, and the blast did not kill off all conduits, as in second son humans are clearly a thing. Given all of these assumptions and connections plot holes still exist. Feel free to poke holes. You savages.

Also I bet Delsin gets his powers from John reincarnated. Cause I'm a dreamer.

In inFamous 1 it was implied Kessler had heavily messed with Cole's life, so the marriage could have happened earlier timewise had Kessler not time traveled. Also, it was implied the First Sons had invested in the ray sphere already because Kessler "Accelerated its development," so that would mean the plague in both timelines would make sense

 

[thelukestar619]

OK this is really late but I think I have the answer to a lot of questions.

Me being the mega nerd that I am, I have read nearly all Infamous lore and nearly all the pages on the Infamous wiki. I'm going to explain how the sequel is possible and how some of these plot holes are possibly not plot holes.

First off in Kessler's time line the ray sphere still exists and it was still detonated but this happened much later because Kessler hadn't interfered with the time line and accelerated the development. This meant Kessler married Trish etc...But what I'm suggesting is that John White was still in the centrer or near it and his atoms got rearranged and everything and still became the beast. This is plausible because he infiltrated the first sons and got to a position where he was trusted to be near the ray sphere while it was activated or he activated it .

The ray sphere blast activated people's conduit gene, like Kessler's and others but not significantly because being in the centrer makes you significantly stronger, but being in the radius of the blast just activates your powers. The plague must have also started, because the cause of it is the ray sphere blast. Conduits weren't affected obviously so the beast John realises this and goes on what seems a rampage and destroys the rest of humanity who aren't conduits activating similar ray sphere explosions killing Kessler's family and friends.

In Kessler's time line to him it seems like the beast is out just for pure destruction. Kessler in this time line not being in the core of the blast slowly develops his powers although not at the rate of Cole's but with many more years to develop, however he is not strong enough to destroy the beast and realises he needs to go back in time to train Cole so he can destroy what he thinks is just pure destruction.

You may think that Kessler knows John white is the beast but I don't think this is true because he killed Alden's father and many other people to activate the ray sphere to give Cole an edge against the beast. He easily he would do the same to John White. Either; John White exist in Kessler's time line and no one knows he is the beast and somehow he still does great things or fulfils his destiny, I can't remember the exact quote, or he thought that John would help Cole.

On to the main plot points due to Kessler's meddling, John white the beast is activated earlier than in his time line. So Cole has less time to train etc... The good ending events of infamous 2 happen and the beast and all conduits are seemingly destroyed right?

Wrong the RFI wasn't fully charged. It's possible Sebastian Wolfe made a miscalculation while conduits around the world did die in Africa or wherever, it's possible somehow that some weren't affected what I presume is that the RFI blast affected new Marais and the surrounding area and some parts of the world where the effect couldn't be amplified or reach for whatever reason not all and that's why conduits are still alive in second son.

This is where it gets confusing for me in Infamous second son it says that after the events of what happened in new Marais, conduits are now bio terrorists and a threat to national security or something along those lines. Wouldn't only conduits have died after the RFI blast and are conduits are one in very 1000 people so there wouldn't be that many deaths. Also why would they be threat if only conduits died, so they'd be a threat to other conduits which there locking up WHAT!

Does this mean that the evil ending is cannon and the government got rid of the beast, who knows I hope with all plot holes are covered in Infamous second son but it really doesn't seem like it because it's in a completely different area and none of the characters from Infamous 2 are returning so there not going tie up all these plot holes.

Infamous is in a comic book style so they might do a full retcon of infamous 1 and 2, or retcon 2 but not 1. Any sort of the mix or they might just completely disregard it and mention the events of the previous game very subtly to try create speculation to drag along fans to another game while we hope for answers.

As for Cole being alive bolts recharge him but he was dead not in a near death state like in game play but it's a video game he could become a zombie with electric powers unless the zombie craze is finally over.

 

[crazycat690]

Yeah I was really disappointed with the Best in InFamous 2. Just didn't make any sense, I would rather have had him be a no-name entity, something unknown. They forced him to be John for some unneeded plot twist, it's like they made an effort to screw the story up. And while the third game seems to be toying with the story as well, I dunno, the games are so damn fun I just can't leave it be. The first game obviously had the best story, the second game had the gameplay, if we're lucky Second Son is the best of both worlds.

 

[Bluman]

What's even more annoying is that Sucker Punch didn't do a good job at all of portraying the Beast in the second game like they did in the first. In the first game they made the Beast out to be this ruthless, coldblooded killing machine which hungered to destroy the world and had no care for human life. They didn't translate that well in to the second one. In inFamous 2 the Beast doesn't seem that bad at all. He's actually trying to save the world in his own twisted, radical way. In fact the game almost tries to get you to sympathize with John for all his hardship and having to "pull himself back together atom by atom". That's such crap. It's goes completely against how they portrayed the Beast in the first game and definitely doesn't make him look like a monster. I'm capable of letting some of the character inconsistencies go between both games but the Beast one was just too much. Sucker punch definitely could've done a better job on the beast in the second game. Oh well.

i agree with this.

 

[poklane]

To question number one, read my theory: http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/lets-talk-about-delsins-connections-to-cole.453152921/

 

[TheGBRedcoat]

What's even more annoying is that Sucker Punch didn't do a good job at all of portraying the Beast in the second game like they did in the first. In the first game they made the Beast out to be this ruthless, coldblooded killing machine which hungered to destroy the world and had no care for human life. They didn't translate that well in to the second one. In inFamous 2 the Beast doesn't seem that bad at all. He's actually trying to save the world in his own twisted, radical way. In fact the game almost tries to get you to sympathize with John for all his hardship and having to "pull himself back together atom by atom". That's such crap. It's goes completely against how they portrayed the Beast in the first game and definitely doesn't make him look like a monster. I'm capable of letting some of the character inconsistencies go between both games but the Beast one was just too much. Sucker punch definitely could've done a better job on the beast in the second game. Oh well.

i agree with this.

John is naturally evil. The difference between the two timelines is that in Cole's he uses the plague as an excuse in his own mind to legitimise what he's doing. There isn't a plague in Kessler's timeline so he can't use it as an excuse. There aren't any inconsistencies.

 

[TheGBRedcoat]

Yeah I was really disappointed with the Best in InFamous 2. Just didn't make any sense, I would rather have had him be a no-name entity, something unknown. They forced him to be John for some unneeded plot twist, it's like they made an effort to screw the story up. And while the third game seems to be toying with the story as well, I dunno, the games are so damn fun I just can't leave it be. The first game obviously had the best story, the second game had the gameplay, if we're lucky Second Son is the best of both worlds.

If the Beast hadn't been John then it would likely have been many years before his powers manifested. Cole would already be incredibly powerful and could have easily defeated him, making a sequel extremely unexciting.

 

[Intheworldofnim]

John is naturally evil. The difference between the two timelines is that in Cole's he uses the plague as an excuse in his own mind to legitimise what he's doing. There isn't a plague in Kessler's timeline so he can't use it as an excuse. There aren't any inconsistencies.

what are you talking about? the beast had the SAME MISSION in Kessler's timeline. Kessler did NOT originate the ray sphere he only SPED UP it's development. that means the Ray sphere STILL existed in kesslers timeline and where a ray sphere exists, the plague exists. The beast is only seen as a mindless killing machine through Kessler's point of view. There is no indication that the beast was just using the ray sphere as an excuse to destroy everything, that's just speculation on your part and it wouldn't make sense either for the writers to have everyone believe that.

 

[TheGBRedcoat]

John is naturally evil. The difference between the two timelines is that in Cole's he uses the plague as an excuse in his own mind to legitimise what he's doing. There isn't a plague in Kessler's timeline so he can't use it as an excuse. There aren't any inconsistencies.

what are you talking about? the beast had the SAME MISSION in Kessler's timeline. Kessler did NOT originate the ray sphere he only SPED UP it's development. that means the Ray sphere STILL existed in kesslers timeline and where a ray sphere exists, the plague exists. The beast is only seen as a mindless killing machine through Kessler's point of view. There is no indication that the beast was just using the ray sphere as an excuse to destroy everything, that's just speculation on your part and it wouldn't make sense either for the writers to have everyone believe that.

No, you're wrong. The fact it was in development doesn't mean it exists, and it definitely doesn't mean they blew one up in the middle of a City. Not to mention you have completely misread my post, I stated that the Beast is using the plague as an excuse in Cole's timeline dumbass, learn to read. This is something they devote an entire cutscene to in Infamous 2 when Cole meets the Beast in the gas works. He's using the plague and the fact he can save conduits as an excuse to destroy everything. In Kessler's timeline it shows that he's just destroying everything anyway, Kessler also never mentions a plague, not mentioning something as important as that implies it doesn't exist. Also it's safe to say John wasn't ripped to shreds by the Ray Sphere in Kessler's timeline as the odds of that would be astronomical, so he isn't driven to insanity and decides to destroy everything for his own sake. The plague was created by the Ray Sphere radiation in Empire City; there isn't any reason why the Ray Sphere would have been blown up at all, nevermind in a populated area, in Kessler's timeline.

It is not speculation that John was using the plague as a reason to kill everyone to save the conduits, he states this several times. The problem is there is absolutely zero evidence of a plague in Kessler's timeline and no reason why one should exist, so John was still motivated to destroy the world likely for his own gain or pleasure; because he's evil.

 

[SNSReaper]

as for John being evil, if he said there was something wrong inside the NSA (as i believe i read on this forum somewhere earlier), maybe he went mad because of that scenario? he could have been blamed or held responsible for what ever it was that he suspected was wrong. The Beast in Kessler's time could have been mad at America for turning on him.
then again trying to understand an undone timeline is kind of pointless because i dont think we will be seeing anything else from it.

 

[SickeneDSara]

Pretty sure John was the Beast, he was in a way fitting to the image of the Beast. They just couldnt have some no name person, killing everyone for no reason. It would make even less sense if you actually think about it.

My money is on Alden being the InFamous 3 bad guy. He had psychic powers naturally without the ray sphere. Probably the only person not effected by the RFI. That scene on the bridge was total sequel bate. I though he would be in InFamous 2 or at least 3.

My money is also on Alden. Makes sense to me.

 

[mrgardoki]

Finished Infamous 2 the other day and almost done with my evil play through now. I stopped trying to figure out what is going on
I'm just enjoying the game play.