NHL has officially announced: it will not participate in 2018 Winter Olympics
- Thread starter tmg.exe
- Start date
Ted already said he'd let Ovie and Backstrom go...so it's just gonna be a case of all the owners letting their top guys go anyways.
ya.
unless the habs are playing, ill be watching olympics over the NHL. Pretty dumb that they want to compete..
unless the habs are playing, ill be watching olympics over the NHL. Pretty dumb that they want to compete..
deity_of_death
I am a leaf on the wind - watch how I soar
- Sep 6, 2000
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There have been reports that the NHL will block individual owners from granting permission to players to leave for the Olympics.
block the owners? lol what?
deity_of_death
I am a leaf on the wind - watch how I soar
- Sep 6, 2000
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Rick Westhead had it earlier today but I've seen several different reporter make similar comments.
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KingShmeag
Jurassic Park
ill watch NHL hockey over olympics without NHLers anyday.
My allegiance will always be Canadiens >>>>> Olympic Canada>>>>> NHL.
Although who i am i kidding, I basically always have 3 games on at the same time anyways so it doesnt really matter
If they actually pull this shit and then try to come back in Beijing because its China I hope the IIHF and IOC tells the NHL to fuck off
- Aug 31, 2001
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As I understand it (per Bob McKenzie), if the NHL comes back in Beijing, it'll be because the local Olympic group fronts the money (as Vancouver and Sochi did, and PyeongChang was unwilling to).
If they come back in China, it's not because the NHL wants China, it'll be because China wants the NHL. And South Korea gives no fucks (nor do they give Won).
The IOC and IIHF may be pissed, but if China wants the NHL and are willing to pay to have NHL players at their hosted games, the IOC and IIHF aren't going to stand between them.
If they come back in China, it's not because the NHL wants China, it'll be because China wants the NHL. And South Korea gives no fucks (nor do they give Won).
The IOC and IIHF may be pissed, but if China wants the NHL and are willing to pay to have NHL players at their hosted games, the IOC and IIHF aren't going to stand between them.
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Eat shit, billionaires.
HuskerTornado
♪ Your delusions are yours, and not mine ♪
The IOC is the worst in all this.
Despite saying the matter is closed, I'm not so sure it actually is.
Despite saying the matter is closed, I'm not so sure it actually is.
so the majority of the PA doesn't give a shit other than maybe getting the time off, which isn't a good reason to go to the olympics
the olympic hosts don't care
the owners do it as a concession to their star players as far as I can tell (NHL makes pretty much no money on it, right?)
so what we have is an elite group of prima donna players, even though the olympic hosts don't give a shit if they come, crying about going? and the consensus is "boooo, Bettman sucks".... fucking get over yourselves (NHL stars griping about it) is my thoughts
the olympic hosts don't care
the owners do it as a concession to their star players as far as I can tell (NHL makes pretty much no money on it, right?)
so what we have is an elite group of prima donna players, even though the olympic hosts don't give a shit if they come, crying about going? and the consensus is "boooo, Bettman sucks".... fucking get over yourselves (NHL stars griping about it) is my thoughts
- Aug 31, 2001
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And it should be noted that the players have been offered the Olympics in exchange for extending the CBA (or more accurately, making an early commit to their continuation option, saying they will not opt-out at their first opportunity). Which they rejected out of hand. There's going to be another stoppage, as soon as the players are able, because the players are demanding major concessions, the owners have offered status quo and been rejected.
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"so the majority of the PA doesn't give a shit other than maybe getting the time off, which isn't a good reason to go to the olympics"
I don't see that as the case...seems like even retired players are upset about the decision.
I personally don't like to see my co-workers to be "held back by the man" if they are good enough and have worked hard enough towards a goal, even if I am not good enough or able to go after that goal for other reasons.
I mean using this as an example...I don't really care about watching the Olympics and I don't really care who wins, but the reason I want players to go is because I know how important it is to the one of the ones I care about the most. I personally like seeing people have the chance to go after their goals, especially the ones that work hard to be in the position to even have a chance for those goals.
I don't see that as the case...seems like even retired players are upset about the decision.
I personally don't like to see my co-workers to be "held back by the man" if they are good enough and have worked hard enough towards a goal, even if I am not good enough or able to go after that goal for other reasons.
I mean using this as an example...I don't really care about watching the Olympics and I don't really care who wins, but the reason I want players to go is because I know how important it is to the one of the ones I care about the most. I personally like seeing people have the chance to go after their goals, especially the ones that work hard to be in the position to even have a chance for those goals.
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let's assume that's true, doom, which I don't think it necessarily is, the players have been offered a path to olympic participation. if their take is "it's important to all of us, but we're not willing to give anything up to go" then although I question their sincerity as a *whole* (i.e. not just the select few who would actually go and probably do really care), it becomes moot to me because extending the CBA is a fair financial 'give' for the financial 'take' they are asking for, imo.
I appreciate your 'real world' example and the sentiment, but if you want to pursue a goal outside of your professional obligations you need to expect some personal disruption and sacrifice. and I think that's where the PA struggles with this. for whatever is said publicly, and however sincere the PA may be in wanting the stars to 'chase their dreams', when it comes down to it they do not want to sacrifice to make it happen.
I appreciate your 'real world' example and the sentiment, but if you want to pursue a goal outside of your professional obligations you need to expect some personal disruption and sacrifice. and I think that's where the PA struggles with this. for whatever is said publicly, and however sincere the PA may be in wanting the stars to 'chase their dreams', when it comes down to it they do not want to sacrifice to make it happen.
Maybe they feel like they have to keep giving in for the same thing over and over? Have the owners not used this as a bargaining chip every Olympics? Why do the players need to keep giving up something each time to go to the Olympics? Pretty much every other sport in the world its assumed that the best players will get to play for their country if they are good enough. I only really see this issue coming up with hockey (ie: the NHL). Why are the hockey players having to sacrifice things to make owners happy, when every other national athlete seems to be allowed to go play freely?
I'm personally fine with it being left up to the owners and players themselves to work out if they are going or not and the NHL continuing either way. What I don't want to see is some of the better talent from Europe staying in Europe for a couple extra seasons so that they can play in the Olympics. Which I think will start happening for players that are drafted the year of or before an Olympics. Especially with NHL players not being allowed to go, their chance to go will be higher, and their impact will likely be higher since there will be less talent there.
I'm personally fine with it being left up to the owners and players themselves to work out if they are going or not and the NHL continuing either way. What I don't want to see is some of the better talent from Europe staying in Europe for a couple extra seasons so that they can play in the Olympics. Which I think will start happening for players that are drafted the year of or before an Olympics. Especially with NHL players not being allowed to go, their chance to go will be higher, and their impact will likely be higher since there will be less talent there.
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- Aug 31, 2001
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What are they 'sacrificing'? The NHL is offering status quo, not a cut like the past few times. Continued labor peace, at the terms the players agreed to last time (50% of the revenue of an over $4bil a year league) and have done quite well under. The players are saying that status quo is undesirable. They're not being asked to sacrifice - they're being asked to not force owner sacrifices and an inevitable resultant season (or partial season) sacrifice. They declined.
what comparable sports take a break for the Olympics? I think baseball has the same problem (have to break the schedule) and don't go any more. NBA is ideal because olympics are in the off season, right? american football isn't an olympic team sport. outside of that, I think if you're comparing to individual sports or leagues that aren't north american professional, it's a bit of an apples to oranges thing.
I don't see NHL ready players adding year or two to their RFA and UFA age just to compete in the olympics. and player agents, who might be very influential in this decision making, are not likely to support that decision either. could happen, I just don't see it being a problem
I don't see NHL ready players adding year or two to their RFA and UFA age just to compete in the olympics. and player agents, who might be very influential in this decision making, are not likely to support that decision either. could happen, I just don't see it being a problem
- Aug 31, 2001
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Soccer at the Olympics might be a bit of a comparable - not for schedule interruption, but for opposition from the organization that controls the top players.
The IOC ruled to start allowing professionals in 1984, but the FIFA was opposed to the Olympics becoming a threat to the popularity of their cash cow World Cup, and so enacted rules that prevented the best professionals from Europe and South America - those who had played in World Cups before - from participating in the Olympics. Until eventually they just decided to make the Olympics an Under-23 event, assuring it would never be a rival to the World Cup as anything approaching best-on-best.
The IOC ruled to start allowing professionals in 1984, but the FIFA was opposed to the Olympics becoming a threat to the popularity of their cash cow World Cup, and so enacted rules that prevented the best professionals from Europe and South America - those who had played in World Cups before - from participating in the Olympics. Until eventually they just decided to make the Olympics an Under-23 event, assuring it would never be a rival to the World Cup as anything approaching best-on-best.
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I didn't just specify Olympics because it's not the biggest international tournament in every sport, unfair as that might be to the NHL (or NBA). This is a determination made by the players/fans of those sports. However, if you do look at the FIFA World Cup example that tmg used. The biggest soccer leagues in the world do craft the schedule around that tournament. The European leagues all have basically 1 week off a month for all but 2 months of the season to allow for international games. Generally those games are qualifying games but sometimes they are just friendlies with no importance and the richest sports orgs in the world (Real Madrid, Manchester United, etc) all take the risk of their players getting hurt in those games when they sign players that are of international caliber.
The ATP and WTA change schedules for the Olympics. Yeah I know, not team owned players. Still. Last go around it was in the middle of the hard court season, which is generally considered the 2nd best part of the tennis season (after June).
Even if the NBA isn't having to change schedule, it still takes the risk of players being hurt and missing the start of the next season. Does it not? Isn't that one of the big reasons NHL Owners don't want tp let the players go?
As for the baseball question, I don't think basbeall is even in the Olympics. I'm not sure why, pretty sure it has enough countries to make the competition more competitive then basketball (assuming the best players all went).
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"not a cut like the past few times."
Cause I don't follow that stuff like I used to and was legit asking earlier..."cut like the past few times" refers to the Owners getting players to cut their current contracts? Or a cut of some pool of money?? Why exactly are the players not happy with status quo?
"and player agents, who might be very influential in this decision making, are not likely to support that decision either. "
Pretty sure a player agent that starts off by asking a player to give up their goals would get canned pretty quickly.
I do believe SOME players would wait a year and stay in Russia or Sweden (etc) if they thought they'd get to play in the Olympics. Look at Kuznetsov's first game in the NHL (March 2014). Pretty odd timing if you think Olympics aren't involved in the decision on when to come over. He was drafted in 2010 for reference.
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Either way, like I said earlier, I'm not really a huge fan of watching Olympics. I really only want Ovie to go because I know its something that has been important to him his whole life. He has given everything to the NHL and the Caps over his career. I don't want to see him being blocked from going because some other owner is too much of a coward to take responsibility from blocking his star player from going. If the NHL wants to have a few weeks without some star players playing, I'm fine with it. I'm actually used to it from watching soccer - sometimes star players miss a few games due to being tired due to travel and extra international games. If a team can't function without its star for a few weeks - oh well.
My only issue was assuming that the majority of players didn't care about the issue because its only the stars that get to play.
The ATP and WTA change schedules for the Olympics. Yeah I know, not team owned players. Still. Last go around it was in the middle of the hard court season, which is generally considered the 2nd best part of the tennis season (after June).
Even if the NBA isn't having to change schedule, it still takes the risk of players being hurt and missing the start of the next season. Does it not? Isn't that one of the big reasons NHL Owners don't want tp let the players go?
As for the baseball question, I don't think basbeall is even in the Olympics. I'm not sure why, pretty sure it has enough countries to make the competition more competitive then basketball (assuming the best players all went).
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"not a cut like the past few times."
Cause I don't follow that stuff like I used to and was legit asking earlier..."cut like the past few times" refers to the Owners getting players to cut their current contracts? Or a cut of some pool of money?? Why exactly are the players not happy with status quo?
"and player agents, who might be very influential in this decision making, are not likely to support that decision either. "
Pretty sure a player agent that starts off by asking a player to give up their goals would get canned pretty quickly.
I do believe SOME players would wait a year and stay in Russia or Sweden (etc) if they thought they'd get to play in the Olympics. Look at Kuznetsov's first game in the NHL (March 2014). Pretty odd timing if you think Olympics aren't involved in the decision on when to come over. He was drafted in 2010 for reference.
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Either way, like I said earlier, I'm not really a huge fan of watching Olympics. I really only want Ovie to go because I know its something that has been important to him his whole life. He has given everything to the NHL and the Caps over his career. I don't want to see him being blocked from going because some other owner is too much of a coward to take responsibility from blocking his star player from going. If the NHL wants to have a few weeks without some star players playing, I'm fine with it. I'm actually used to it from watching soccer - sometimes star players miss a few games due to being tired due to travel and extra international games. If a team can't function without its star for a few weeks - oh well.
My only issue was assuming that the majority of players didn't care about the issue because its only the stars that get to play.
"My only issue was assuming that the majority of players didn't care about the issue because its only the stars that get to play."
I disagree, I think the players would press the PA to negotiate something if it was an issue important to the majority.
I'm kinda warming up to this world cup thing or whatever it's called anyway
I disagree, I think the players would press the PA to negotiate something if it was an issue important to the majority.
I'm kinda warming up to this world cup thing or whatever it's called anyway
- Sep 20, 2003
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OK guys I just solved the problem, and probably am the first person to ever come up with this brilliant solution, stick with me...
Move ice hockey to the Summer Olympics. We have the technology.
No break in the middle of a season needed, leave it to teams to work out if contracts allow Olympic participation in the offseason.
Move ice hockey to the Summer Olympics. We have the technology.
No break in the middle of a season needed, leave it to teams to work out if contracts allow Olympic participation in the offseason.
I guess we'll just have to disagree. I could think of several more plausible reasons why this happened. We'll probably never get enough of the behind the scenes picture to say the exact reason why it happened.
For what its worth the NHL made the announcement for 2014 Olympics in July 2013, so this one came a bit earlier, and during an important part of the NHL season...
well, for the owners it's all about money. they ain't goin for nothing. for the players it's only important to the extent they don't have to give anything up, is all I'm saying
brilliant [URL='http://www.ign.com/boards/members/dquigley.76/']@dquigley[/URL] , haha
brilliant [URL='http://www.ign.com/boards/members/dquigley.76/']@dquigley[/URL] , haha
twisted_time48
No Longer a Noob
- Oct 30, 2010
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This is disappointing. I'll still watch Olympic hockey, but it won't be as big a priority as it usually is.
UncleBen59
No Longer a Noob
While Olympic footy is technically U-23 each team can bring 5? O-23 players so its stars and young guys which is ok.
Not going is just shortsighted how do you grow a sport when you take the best players away from the time it has the most eyeballs world wide and in America? And lets not pretend the time difference matters, NBC doesn't broadcast shit live when the timezone isn't much of a problem anyways and that's how your average American is watching
Edit- Baseball was voted out before London and is coming back for Tokyo if I'm not mistaken. Summer Olympics seems to do more sport swapping depending on upcoming hosts
Not going is just shortsighted how do you grow a sport when you take the best players away from the time it has the most eyeballs world wide and in America? And lets not pretend the time difference matters, NBC doesn't broadcast shit live when the timezone isn't much of a problem anyways and that's how your average American is watching
Edit- Baseball was voted out before London and is coming back for Tokyo if I'm not mistaken. Summer Olympics seems to do more sport swapping depending on upcoming hosts
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NHL will be back for China. They just didn't feel like going to Korea. IOC isn't going to lock out NHL players just because the league wants to choose their spots.
UncleBen59
No Longer a Noob
Yeah they will. IOC made it clear that the NHL cant "pick and choose what Olympics they want to go to" so there's a good chance that '22 will be a similar situation
'Making things clear' 6 years in advance is different.
Like I said earlier I hope the IOC and IIHF tell them to fuck off for China but they probably won't
UncleBen59
No Longer a Noob
For the record, at least 80% of Bruins fans hate Jacobs.
Newinternetaccount
Noob
Seems like Canada totally voluntary gives the men's tournament gold-medal to Russia.
- Aug 31, 2001
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When 24 of 31 NHL governors govern teams based in the US, I don't think attributing the blame to Canada here makes sense. Hockey Canada, the sole Canadian government arm involved in hockey, surely wants to send the best, but the owners dictate the terms of their contracted players' ability to play outside the NHL. And the IOC and IIHF (and the NHLPA) didn't make the concessions they'd have needed to get the owners to take the risks and financial loss by season suspension, sending their assets to earn money for someone else.
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im sorry but if im a canadian owner.. why the hell would i want my players going?
if im molson i definitely vote against it. price, weber and pacioretty all for sure playing and then a few more probably going? pass.
if it was guaranteed that USA would win the gold then i think you'd see more owners want the players to go. but if you're arizona, and USA bows out in the quarters.. then theres no hockey going on at the olympics or at your home arena. which isnt good.
i get the players want to go, but meh. Id rather they didnt. im a canadiens fan first and a team canada fan second. now if price, weber, patches and galchenyuk could somehow not go? then ya go for it!
granted if team canada didnt have 3 golds since 2002 maybe i would be singing a different tune
if im molson i definitely vote against it. price, weber and pacioretty all for sure playing and then a few more probably going? pass.
if it was guaranteed that USA would win the gold then i think you'd see more owners want the players to go. but if you're arizona, and USA bows out in the quarters.. then theres no hockey going on at the olympics or at your home arena. which isnt good.
i get the players want to go, but meh. Id rather they didnt. im a canadiens fan first and a team canada fan second. now if price, weber, patches and galchenyuk could somehow not go? then ya go for it!
granted if team canada didnt have 3 golds since 2002 maybe i would be singing a different tune
UncleBen59
No Longer a Noob
I'm just waiting for the kids from BC, BU, NoDak, Minnesota, etc. to be on the US team and everyone compares them to the 1980 team...
If it's a team of college players, Tyler Wall should be the goalie, just sayin'
If it's a team of college players, Tyler Wall should be the goalie, just sayin'
KingShmeag
Jurassic Park
USA's star STEVE MOSES, PARTING THE DEFENSE