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Zephyr Jul 1 @ 2:53pm
Performance comparison
So, this might also be interesting for the devs and I will make it fully available on the crate forums also if possible.

System: Ryzen 5800 X3d, RX 7900XT (driver 24.6.1), 32 GB CL14 3200 DDR4 RAM, installed on Samsung Evo 970 NVMe (PCIE 3.0), Windows 10 Professional current build.

3 videos, same town, same save.

First is 0.92 (d) which really gave me headaches
https://youtu.be/OdxJfp43NDk

While still playable I did not like it that much after I reached 800+ people. Much more than 1K is not feasible here in my opinion.

The second video is from 0.93 playtest, I guess it is fair to say this is WIP! So, by no means this should represent final 0.93 until the devs give it a go.
https://youtu.be/cx1FQIVr-oQ

The third video is again 0.93, same town, same save, but using DXVK to essentially emulate Vukan API instead of DX11. This is always fun because it always behaves very different than DirectX API. In some cases it leads to games that use DX9 (or D10/11) running better, especially on AMD GPUs. It depends :). The usage of the GPU is however clearly different with DXVK and I could crank up the juice there a little more I guess. Still the main limitation is clearly the CPU.

So, this is an experiment, I used it before for this game and others as well.
https://youtu.be/oyVq4Bknrlo

The max FPS are not as high as in DX11, but more consistent, I like it better. At higher game speed the FPS are higher than with DX11 and also more consistent.

Overall 0.93 is certainly a good step in the right direction, but my system would likely still be incapable to go much beyond 1-1.2K towns with FPS that I would personally find tolerable.

BTW. Hay seems broken in my save, I did not check what happened, all hay fields are empty and there is something wrong with bird eggs and mushrooms possibly.
Last edited by Zephyr; 23 hours ago
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Showing 1-13 of 13 comments
pckirk Jul 1 @ 4:00pm 
It is all the buildings with smoke, it is all of the villagers walking to and from places. The more you have, the more it bogs down CPU, and GPU.
#1
Zephyr Jul 1 @ 11:26pm 
Originally posted by pckirk:
It is all the buildings with smoke, it is all of the villagers walking to and from places. The more you have, the more it bogs down CPU, and GPU.
Yeah, sure, but ideally this will get much better along the way.
#2
skjutengris Jul 2 @ 1:21am 
up to 600 give or take people performance is good.
at 800 population game starts to be bogged down.
Not really a big difference between 9.2 to 9.3 playtest

7800x3d, playing in 4k using a 6950xt downclocked to 100w.
I would assume here that the cpu and memory is hit more due to all the people having to do work and calculations takes processing power.

One can still make tier 4 on 600 population.

atm I see 30 to 80 fps depending what area at 840 people.
gpu at 60% and cpu at 25%
Last edited by skjutengris; Jul 2 @ 1:37am
#3
Zephyr Jul 2 @ 8:20am 
Originally posted by skjutengris:
up to 600 give or take people performance is good.
at 800 population game starts to be bogged down.
Not really a big difference between 9.2 to 9.3 playtest

7800x3d, playing in 4k using a 6950xt downclocked to 100w.
I would assume here that the cpu and memory is hit more due to all the people having to do work and calculations takes processing power.

One can still make tier 4 on 600 population.

atm I see 30 to 80 fps depending what area at 840 people.
gpu at 60% and cpu at 25%
Hm, for me there are definitely improvements, but indeed i would have hoped for more. In areas with lots of people and builduings it still goes down to 30-40 FPS in 0.93 when the settlement is 1k+. Strong degradation generally comes when >800 ppl are reached, yes.

I made a new experiment with UV+OC+DXVK (Vulkan), to see what is at all possible. With this it is definitely possible to squeeze out some more FPS.

Version 0.93 playtest:

Vulkan, DXVK
https://youtu.be/Scsr0vmTpF4

DX11, same driver profile for comparison.
https://youtu.be/60h0Sam3tbE

Interestingly 0.93 seems to have increased GPU load quite massivley in DX11 also (visible in above videos), even when there seems to be a general CPU limitation.

Such a downclock as you use seems very drastic, even for a lighter game like FF. I also play at 4K and my RX 7900XT always wants 200+W to support full potential in the game. When I downclock further there are very noticeable performance losses.
Last edited by Zephyr; Jul 2 @ 3:01pm
#4
風鈴 Jul 2 @ 8:29pm 
When the number of attackers exceeds 700, the difficulty of the game changes from quantity to quality, and the difficulty increases a lot. At that time, the game begins to become challenging enough.

I wish everyone the best of luck in making the game progress to that level.
#5
skjutengris Jul 4 @ 8:01am 
dont mind the loss, I get 70fps less in grim dawn, 150 instead of 220+ but wont affect gameplay which is my go to preference. If it did, i can raise the mhz a bit.
I rather have a silent system running the game
#6
Zephyr Jul 4 @ 9:24am 
Originally posted by skjutengris:
dont mind the loss, I get 70fps less in grim dawn, 150 instead of 220+ but wont affect gameplay which is my go to preference. If it did, i can raise the mhz a bit.
I rather have a silent system running the game
In such a case it does not matter, especially not for Grim Dawn or FF. If you are happy it is always fine. But in your shoes I would test once to give the GPU more juice for FF.
#7
sasha Jul 4 @ 9:52am 
oh yeah i actually was having stutters like every few seconds but i tried the most recent beta they put out and it seems fixed? maybe im just coping LOL idk i rlly wanna like this game its almost the perfect city builder for me

hmm even without the stutters i only have 60 people but when im zoomed out all the way the fps already drops to 44-48... idk if i should just refund it and buy ostriv instead or not :/
Last edited by sasha; Jul 4 @ 10:24am
#8
Zephyr 23 hours ago 
Originally posted by sasha:
oh yeah i actually was having stutters like every few seconds but i tried the most recent beta they put out and it seems fixed? maybe im just coping LOL idk i rlly wanna like this game its almost the perfect city builder for me

hmm even without the stutters i only have 60 people but when im zoomed out all the way the fps already drops to 44-48... idk if i should just refund it and buy ostriv instead or not :/
Yeah well, you had the Ryzen 2600, right? So, that is really a stretch for this game, if you want to build larger towns. There is no way around it, that it is a weak CPU for more recent games, especially games that are like Farthest Frontier.

If you cannot reach 60 FPS even with 60 people it is not going to end well :). Youc an wait until 1.0 is there and/or upgrade.

Just so that you can have an idea:

https://www.pcgameshardware.de/Cyberpunk-2077-Spiel-20697/Specials/Cyberpunk-v152-Benchmark-Review-Raytracing-1398562/3/

It is in german just scroll down: The graph has FPS numbers and can show relative performance uplift when you tick the bars. This is only one game example, but it nicely shows the generational Ryzen uplift from the 2000 to the 5000 series (The new 7000 upcoming 9000 series are even more powerful, of course).

While this does not have anything to do with FF it shows what happened to CPUs from the generation you are on using a recent game and a large amount of CPUs. There is a Ryzen 2700 in there which is not really much better than what you have. The AM4 socket on your board should in principle support even a 5800 X3d with a Bios update if the mainboard is good enough, but even a 5700X is a very decent upgrade for 150-170 $ or so. I know I said this already before :). If you cannot do that I think I really would refund in your place until I could upgrade and the final game version is there.

A Ryzen 2600 is not going anywhere anymore with newer really CPU heavy games.
Last edited by Zephyr; 23 hours ago
#9
sasha 23 hours ago 
the game isnt even using that much of my cpu though, so i dont think thats the problem
#10
Zephyr 23 hours ago 
Originally posted by sasha:
the game isnt even using that much of my cpu though, so i dont think thats the problem
Yes it is (almost guaranteed) :). First of all average CPU useage means almost nothing in games. One bogged down thread (core) can be enough. In many games single core performance is still a very major factor. Second: The cache your CPU has. Third: Full scale saturation of a CPU is (almost) never achieved in games, still the CPUs limits :). Early Ryzens were very bad in single core and gaming performance but very cheap and overall ok.

A good indicator (though not 100%) is when the GPU is not at 99-100% in a game while your FPS are still below your set limit (or the GPU simply never reaches 100% without a limit FPS set). You can see easily in my videos what I mean. I set 60 or 67 FPS as limit in FF. Whenever this is not reached and the GPU is not at 99-100 % (top line of overlay) something else limits. The CPU is in such a case the most likely candidate.
Last edited by Zephyr; 23 hours ago
#11
sasha 23 hours ago 
idkkk if this is the ONLY new game where the fps drops like that im pretty sure its the game thats the problem lol

not like i can go back and test it more rn tho cuz if i play it again i wont be able to refund it 0_0
#12
Zephyr 23 hours ago 
Originally posted by sasha:
idkkk if this is the ONLY new game where the fps drops like that im pretty sure its the game thats the problem lol

not like i can go back and test it more rn tho cuz if i play it again i wont be able to refund it 0_0
The game is the problem in a way, of course :). Because it is not well optimized yet and it is really CPU heavy (that will stay). Your CPU is still not that great anymore :). It will manage well enough in most scenarios when you only want 60 FPS average (or nearly), though. I know only a few other games that cause such issues on the CPU Front. Some sort of stutters I would expect for you in more cases, though. Something like Cyberpunk, The Last of Us or Starfield, for example. It all depends on what new games you play. There are also recent pixel art games that run on a toaster :).
Last edited by Zephyr; 23 hours ago
#13
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Date Posted: Jul 1 @ 2:53pm
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